THIS TAPE HAS BEEN RECORDED ON THE 8th of APRIL 1980 IN THE WRAPPING ROOM AT SPRING VALE MILL, CHARLES LANE, HASLINGDEN. THE INFORMANT IS ARNOLD PARKINSON, MULE OVERLOOKER AND THE INTERVIEWER IS MARY HUNTER.
[SG note. Some parts of this transcript were virtually incoherent and I have had to edit very heavily to make sense. The principle I have followed is to preserve the sense and meaning rather than refine the original words. The message is that if you wish to make your own assessment of my accuracy you must go back to the original tape. Sorry if this sounds arbitrary but it was the only practical way to do the job.]
Right I think we were talking about ...
R - On the front of the headstock, the builder rail and the plates on number 88.
On number 88. Right.
R - And as I was saying there is just one thing on this where you can see a rope which is fastened on to the rails where the carriage runs backwards and forwards on these wheels, there is a rope and it goes underneath the carriage itself and it is just a steadying rope really to keep the carriage in line and straight from the headstock to the bask, to the outside of the mule. There is two ropes on at one side, there's two ropes on at the other side, they are just steadying ropes to keep the carriage square. Apart from that there is nothing else on there. Number 89 shows you exactly the same, excepting on this one it does give you a good picture of the rim band and
(50)
your builder plates again, plus on this particular picture .. that particular finger there, which you can see
On the left?
R - On the left hand-side at the inside of the builder plate you’ll see a small finger. Well that finger is also what we call the monkey chain which in inside the carriage. It is, it catches on to a small lever which tightens the chain up that little bit and when the mule gets to the back and backs off it keeps the noses that little bit more tight, there you see? Also underneath there is a small locking nut where there should be a chain coming along from there to the front of the headstock back to a small eye hole underneath, back up to the quadrant. So that all the time that that builder rail ...well not builder rail I shouldn't say that here .. but the builder plates are moving back so as that chain is also being moved back and governing the nosing action to come down.
(loo)
Right. You mentioned something else. It is a good one of the what did you say?
R - The builder plates and the shapes of them with the rail.
Did you may rim plate?
R – No, the rim band.
Oh, which is the rim band?
R – The rim band is the one where it looks like there is two ropes but in fact there is only one, because they run all the way round you see. There is only one rim band on, roughly they're running out to about 78 yards in lengthy but the way we reckon them when we are putting [a new one] on we start off with… If there is no rim band there at first and we have had to put a new one on we’d start off from the outside when we’d thread that. The pulleys that it runs on, are in two grooves in this one pulley you know? So we start off with the outside groove, when we’ve got to the back we go to the inside groove. Now as we threaded that round we come to the back where all the wheels are, and the rope then will come out and looking like it had been put into a figure eight. But it’d be in the inside but when we took it back through underneath the carriage and back to the front again, fetch it back round from the front to come back again it’d come from the inside to the outside then. So you see sometimes you'll see a spinner saying “Oh well, it's inside and outside rim band” and
(150)
that is actually what they’re meaning. It's actually crossed is the rim band but not crossed as you’d think like when you are crossing your fingers. It's actually crossed so that it's running in a straight, more or less in a straight line all the way through. But it is crossed. Now I think that’s about the only thing there is on there.
In there any trouble holding the weight of this headstock on a wooden floor?
(5 min)
R- No. very seldom. Just odd individual times we have got one in the bottom room here which we had trouble with. About two year back when that happened. The eye holes in the beams where the screws are, the big bolts are screwed through into the plates here. The beams must have been going a little bit soft so as the bolts started working backwards and forwards. Now if you look at one of these plates here down on the floor you’ll see that although they’re fastened down they are also allowed about two inches of a slide. Now that means that a fitter coming in can move that plate in that two inch to adjust his mule when he is setting up.
Like the plates on the old railway line?
R - That's right yes. So that you can move them backwards and forwards you know? That's something similar is that. Same with your builder rail, you've got a small eye hole in there so that sometime you can move it back or you can move it forward you know?
(200)
Right, but I did notice that the floor shakes a bit.
R - Yes well that's the vibration of the mule, I mean when it's twisting and that and all the twist and that’s going in at the back. One mule coming in and another mule going out. I mean if you didn't, if you didn't have this particular function going on the whole building would collapse, you can't have something rigid inside, you've got to have it pliable. And that is one reason, why a wooden floor is more suitable for a mule really because of that pliability and going backwards and forwards, it lets you do it. Now, with some mules, I mean in some spinning rooms they've had mules bolted down to the floor and they've had them inserted into lead, the screws, the bolts had been inserted into lead. Like you see some of these builders use these Rawlplug things. Now them’s all right for a limited time then all of a sudden they start wandering backwards and forwards and all of a sudden you've got your whole headstock going back and forward. But oven if the headstock’s going backwards and forwards, sometime the carriages won't be going backwards and forwards, the carriage itself will be going backwards and forwards but the builder rails and the rails that’s carrying the carriage will not he going backwards and forwards, then all of a sudden you've got a crack comes in.
Yes, I am with you yes.
(250)
R – That’s what happens sometimes in a stone floor. In a wood floor you are better off because you don't get a lot of that but you do get it in a stone floor. Then if that happens sometimes I mean you get a lot of bother, well, you've got to take part of the flags out, you've got to concrete it, you've got to make sure that you've got all that lot up at a level to start getting all them out, it's very hard work is that.
So you are better on a wooden floor.
R - You're better off really on a wooden floor, yes. Now 91, that shows you again where the mule is in. It shows you what we’ve talked about before, your counterfolder and your winding folder. But this in actually what they're working on is this one particular lever here, which we call a boot leg. That's the one long un which comes from the folder, it's keyed in, it's keyed on to the folder shaft is them because they’re on to the winding chain, the wires that rung along both of them. And they’re both keyed on at the headstock, them set of that one thing. So any other sickle which in on that mule has to be set to them two, any one which you want, well they have to be set to either one of them, which ones you’re with you know. The boot leg as I say, when the mule comes to the back and it’s done all its twisting and so forth, that boot leg winds up, lifts up with the winding folder going down and there's a small
block on the builder rail. Now you can just about see a small block there. Now that block is just one solid piece of metal, that's all, nothing else. The boot leg lifts up and a small little pulley at the bottom here just drops over on the top of that block, that stops it then from coming off. Also you've got a small lever on top of the block which is keeping that block pressed down on to the builder rail. That's just in a small little slide underneath your block which just slides backwards and forwards with the rail.
So that boot leg comes up from the base.
R- From where it is now when the mule’s in, your winding folder is at, in at the top when the mule is coming out. When the mule goes in the winding folder is at the bottom, but your boot leg in on the top of that block till your mule runs back in. Now when the mule goes back in you’ll see a small bayonet at the bottom of the boot leg which is, that's what we do call them really, it’s a bayonet. And it hits another small lever that’d just underneath the carriage but it’s fastened on to the builder plates on the carriage wheel, it's fastened on to that. That can be adjusted to a matter of five inch or six inch either way can that one small thing. But that lever if you have it one way it’ll knock that boot leg off that bit sooner before the mule goes in. If you have it set too far back, consequently that bayonet, it'll not touch it, the boot leg will stop, the counterfolder will stop where it is down in the winding position. And the winding folder will not change so therefore you've got all your ends down then.
(350)
Yes, to be avoided.
R- To be avoided if possible. Number 92. Well that's quite a good picture of your mule in, the ends coming from the spindle through your steel, through your fluted rollers and your leather rollers, going in between the guide wires back on to the bobbin drum plus the bobbin. And it’s a good picture that. It’s all uniform, all the way along which is, it's a good thing. But it shows you also the difference in leather rollers as I was saying about them with the cleaners. Some are a bit darker than what others are, a bit dirtier.
Yes I am with you.
R - Although they look lighter they are actually dirtier.
Yes, because of the grease.
R - It's the grease and everything else. Ninety-three, well that’s more or less the same, excepting it shows you the bottom part of the spindle where all the spindle wharfes are as we call them.
That's the...
R- It’s a small wheel welded on to the spindle, made very tight. But on the spindle wharfe you fasten a small spindle band which goes inside the carriage on to the tin roller and comes back round. Now then, depending on what side you want them spindle bands, we had it weft way so it goes in the shape of an ‘S’. If we change that band round so that it’s running the other way about so you’d have the spindle running the opposite way. And instead of being weft way it would be twist way, for warping and such as that you see.
And what did you call this wooden bar?
R – That, well it's just a holding down bar really for the spindles to stop them from jumping up.
Yes, what did you call it though.
(15 min)
R - Yes sorry. When we talk about the bottom of the spindle, when we talk about the spindle wharfe board that is the one over the top of the spindle wharfe. Now the spindle wharfe in a small wheel which is attached to the spindles for a spindle band to go on to revolve them. Now the wharfe board over the top, that's all it is, it's just a matter that it's fastened on to two little lugs and it's fastened so that it's just here is the spindle wharfe and to give them the freedom without being able to move out of the way, to stop them jumping up. Because if that board weren't on, we'll say we took that board off, it's just the spindle that goes straight up to the top of your thing. So if that board weren’t on them spindles would be able to jump up. That's all as it’s for. And then for another thing, if we have to change one, if one gets
(450)
catched for some reason, you know gets catched I mean we could soon take that spindle out and put another new one in place of it. If that board were fast and we couldn’t take it off, then you wouldn't be able to take them out. That's why there's just two little pins that slots in so that we just let them pins up, take the board off then take the spindle out.
That's it. You might just make some small comment on number 95*
R - Ninety-five. Well, this is typical isn’t it. I mean this is your canteen, dinner time, that's what I presume. It's dinner time where you've got one or two other people, playing dominoes after their dinner, which is more than likely it would be about five past twelve, ten past.,. probably one or two sneaking in including Joe Pilling and Brian
Why, weren’t they supposed to be there?
R - Well at that time, yes but I mean not at five to twelve like they were at dinner time. I mean you can do nothing about it. but young Pat here, as I say this has been a good lass has this one, a tuber which we’ve had since she were fifteen. And as far as tubing's concerned, and as far as workers is concerned you'll have a job to get a better lass. But they haven't made her redundant, they’ve found her a job over at Grane Road but she's not as content at Grane Road as what she were working here. This is what happens through redundancy things, which can't be helped. But that is one particular sort of lass that this trade is losing. And give or take a month or two, and
it wouldn't surprise me if I don't come up sometimes and somebody tells me
that young Pat’s finished because as I say, them sort of things are happening, and we are losing people. When we do get a good un in this trade now, which is an exceptional thing, and the management will tell you the same thing. When we do get a good un we might be able to keep them for a while, and then all of a sudden something comes like this, short time or sommat else and all of a sudden the good uns have gone so that then we are left with the rubbish again. And it takes a long while to get a decent staff together and we've done pretty fair in this mill as far as having a decent staff. We’ve had one or two bad uns and I wish you could have been here four or five years since. The lad what's took the photos, I wish he could have been here to take the photos of one or two of the lads which we've had in this particular trade. It’d give you a good idea of what we’ve had to put up with. And then this is what happens. In this trade now, it’s been going down and going down and nobody’d ever been able to stop it. Not really, they’re still not trying, not as hard as they should do.
I felt that, every time I’ve been here, that there is a very friendly atmosphere.
R- There is quite a good friendly atmosphere. You get one or two that tries to come out with one or two wisecracks you know. The fly boys as we call them, them's the ones that want to be sat down in there, in the canteen, they don't want to be bothered over doing anything else. If they can get away with it they will do. I mean you've got an example not long since with one lad that were in there at the same time as meself, no names because he doesn't need to be mentioned, but that lad now is being made redundant the same as us all. Now, he is under the obligation that he thinks the country and the rest of the mill should owe him something. It only owes him what he's put into it. And if he hadn’t have been here, he wouldn’t have been here so long excepting for two things. He’s had a good easy job in one respect, he's had time on his hands to he able to play about, read his books and what not and he’s also been able to get his overtime in. Now a lot more mills won’t put up with things like that, not chasing overtime and all. We've got another one that works in the card room that had time off work without number but when he’s come in, if it's been his particular day for overtime he worked on it. Now he might have been off two days but this is the sort of things that this particular trade has been having to put up with. Now it's not running nobody down or anything else, it’s just the way that we’ve been saddled with labour. And that's the way it's been. It’s been going steadily worse every year that's gone over your head. But as I say in the spinning room department we’ve done pretty fair because we've only really one and not a bad lad but at the same time he could
have been a hundred per cent better but he is the only one we have now that's been anything at all. I mean a year or two since, we’d three or four of them. But I got a bit weary, and I kept having a do at Roy and I told him straight that I wasn’t putting up with it. Either we got shut of them or I get shot. And I said “You take it on your own shoulders.” Well you can’t expect to get good work out of bad relationships. You see, when we talk about running a pair of mules and we want a pair of lads working in that mule room, you get one bad un in that pair of mules and you don’t just get one, you don't just get the bad un, you get the good one being bad because the good un will turn automatically and go back to the bad un. And this is what happens. I mean, a
lot of them before used to try to do it the other way, “Oh we’ll put him with him because he is a bad un and he is a good un so the good un will work harder to pull him through. But that were all right, it were taking the, it were taking the guts and everything else out of the good un to keep his wage up .. and the bad un were being all right, he were having a pound or two put in his pocket. But eventually the good un would either leave the job, leave the trade or otherwise go the same way as him, then at finishing up you were having to finish them both which should never have been allowed. But this is what it used to be once over. And that's what I mean when I say if you get two good lads working on a pair of mules you get better production, you may get better quality and everything else. But, like, as I say, through the years it has deteriorated. Are you right now?
Yes. Thank you very much for everything Arnold.
R- Right, thank you.
SCG/22 June 2003
3,563 words.