Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post Reply
User avatar
Wendyf
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 4442
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:26
Location: Lower Burnt Hill, looking out over Barlick

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Wendyf » 17 May 2017, 06:07

Can't you use a fine wick together with a fine soldering tip Ian?

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 38130
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Stanley » 17 May 2017, 06:09

All he has to do is pop round Wendy.... I have little doubt we can find a solution. That's what sheds are for....
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

User avatar
Wendyf
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 4442
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:26
Location: Lower Burnt Hill, looking out over Barlick

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Wendyf » 17 May 2017, 06:17

Col says he uses a hot air gun with a very fine pipe together with wick. You have brought back memories from my days doing assembly work. I loved desoldering. :smile:

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 38130
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Stanley » 17 May 2017, 06:32

Is there no end to this woman's talents????
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

User avatar
Wendyf
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 4442
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:26
Location: Lower Burnt Hill, looking out over Barlick

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Wendyf » 17 May 2017, 08:06

Col has one of these amongst his clutter Ian, looks like a slightly finer tip than your cheapo if you want to borrow it.
https://uk.rs-online.com/mobile/p/solde ... s/0604501/

User avatar
Tizer
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 7519
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 19:46
Location: Somerset, UK

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Tizer » 17 May 2017, 08:20

We'd have won WW2 a lot faster if we'd had Wendy in charge of all those women working in the aircraft factories! :extrawink:

User avatar
PanBiker
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 6616
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 13:07
Location: Barnoldswick - In the West Riding of Yorkshire, always was, always will be.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by PanBiker » 17 May 2017, 08:48

Wendyf wrote:
17 May 2017, 08:06
Col has one of these amongst his clutter Ian, looks like a slightly finer tip than your cheapo if you want to borrow it.
https://uk.rs-online.com/mobile/p/solde ... s/0604501/.
Ooh Wendy, that looks just the job, it looks like the tip is similar to my Weller pro stuff.

I thought about using solder wick and a fine iron but I don't think there is enough space with the crowded SM components, they are very tightly packed around some of the pads. I tried reloading the plated through holes with fresh solder and flux then sucking from the top but could not get enough heat transfer. I will have to go from the back of the board. It would be doddle if my Weller was operable.

No exams this morning so I could pop up if that's OK Wendy.

I know where Stanley is so I will use you as plan B if I have to, no point in shaving metal if you don't need to
Ian

User avatar
Wendyf
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 4442
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:26
Location: Lower Burnt Hill, looking out over Barlick

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Wendyf » 17 May 2017, 09:05

I'm in the library Ian, and Col has an appointment at the doctor's at 11am, so he will be out by 10.30ish. I'll check when he will be back...

User avatar
PanBiker
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 6616
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 13:07
Location: Barnoldswick - In the West Riding of Yorkshire, always was, always will be.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by PanBiker » 17 May 2017, 09:51

PM's have been exchanged and I am calling at Wendy's when I have invigilated today's RE exam up at school.

My Chinese cheapo iron looks like a direct copy of the one that Col has apart from the tip size, could have been made in the same factory (and probably was), stick a different brand on it and sell it at 10 times more, cunning these Chinese. :extrawink:

It would still be good to have the facility to use my Weller tips on mine though at some point.
Ian

User avatar
PanBiker
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 6616
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 13:07
Location: Barnoldswick - In the West Riding of Yorkshire, always was, always will be.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by PanBiker » 17 May 2017, 10:17

Wendyf wrote:
17 May 2017, 08:06
Col has one of these amongst his clutter Ian,
Just re read your post Wendy and realised, this in not clutter it's treasure! :smile:
Ian

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 38130
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Stanley » 17 May 2017, 13:27

Nice to see the problem solved. Making an adapter for the other tips shouldn't be Plan B but
future proofing....
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

User avatar
PanBiker
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 6616
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 13:07
Location: Barnoldswick - In the West Riding of Yorkshire, always was, always will be.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by PanBiker » 17 May 2017, 14:50

My thoughts also Stanley and you can future proof all you like, I'll drop it off sometime. Shame not to utilise the miniature tips I already have. Any adaptor will have to take them "as is" so that if I do come across a new to me head unit at the right price I will still have the tips to fit. I have a range, 1mm to about 2.5mm. The head units do come up on Ebay from time to time as do the complete stations which still command a reasonable price for the whole kit and caboodle.

Just about to set off for Wendy's.
Ian

User avatar
PanBiker
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 6616
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 13:07
Location: Barnoldswick - In the West Riding of Yorkshire, always was, always will be.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by PanBiker » 17 May 2017, 20:04

I popped up to Wendyand Col's and picked up the combo iron and pump variant which looked to have a much smaller tip than the one I have bought.

We had a good chat for an hour over a brew.

Offering it up to the back of the PCB, unfortunately its still about twice the size of my largest tip from the Weller, in fact one of my desolder tips will fit into the hole on the pump on Col's variant. :sad:

So it looking like plan B or as Stanley says future proofing for the Chinese Iron with my Weller tips
Ian

User avatar
Wendyf
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 4442
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:26
Location: Lower Burnt Hill, looking out over Barlick

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Wendyf » 17 May 2017, 20:37

:sad: Oh dear!

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 38130
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Stanley » 18 May 2017, 03:43

He's a pernickety sod isn't he Wendy...... Never mind, get here any morning around 9AM Ian and lets see if we can make a good job for you. I have some of the smallest taps and dies in both BA and Metric and I suspect that's what we are looking at here.
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

User avatar
PanBiker
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 6616
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 13:07
Location: Barnoldswick - In the West Riding of Yorkshire, always was, always will be.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by PanBiker » 18 May 2017, 07:20

Thanks Stanley, I cant do 9am as I'm on exams this morning, just about to leave. I should be done today for 11am though so I could call around then.

I'll check the thread when I get home.
Ian

User avatar
PanBiker
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 6616
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 13:07
Location: Barnoldswick - In the West Riding of Yorkshire, always was, always will be.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by PanBiker » 18 May 2017, 15:00

Stanley has had a look at the rabbit as it were. Fag packet drawing has been made.

Seems like Weller have bee cute with their desoldering tips producing them with a proprietary thread. This explains why every single technical document I have turned up on the tips does not show the thread size. Every other dimension is given. overall tip diameter internal hole diameter, depth of the tip from the iron but no detail for the screw thread.

Anyway a new adaptor is on the cards which will be a best fit, the tip tightens down on a test tapping so should be OK with a bit of PTFE. This should give a good enough seal to do what I want. The Chinese end of the deal is a bit more standard so we should get a proper fit at the iron end.
Ian

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 38130
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Stanley » 19 May 2017, 03:07

Bring the tip and the gun when you come tomorrow morning. I'll make it in brass, it struck me that tinning it would tighten the fit a bit. That and PTFE should let you win .5mm.
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 38130
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Stanley » 19 May 2017, 11:09

For better or worse they are done Ian and waiting for you.....
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

User avatar
PanBiker
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 6616
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 13:07
Location: Barnoldswick - In the West Riding of Yorkshire, always was, always will be.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by PanBiker » 19 May 2017, 14:57

Thanks Stanley, noted in the Shed thread, I'll pop round tomorrow morning.
Ian

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 38130
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Stanley » 21 May 2017, 04:35

No word yet from the maestro. I'm dying to know whether we cracked it!
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

User avatar
PanBiker
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 6616
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 13:07
Location: Barnoldswick - In the West Riding of Yorkshire, always was, always will be.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by PanBiker » 21 May 2017, 09:48

I'm afraid not Stanley, I can't get a sufficient seal on the oversized thread, the manganese applied just liquefies and bubbles out of the joint. Tip temperature is down also due to the lack of a tight mechanical fit. :sad:

I have a potential light at the end of the tunnel though, I have been revisiting my vac desoldering and have found that the heating element itself is intact. I shoved 24v AC directly into it from the front auxiliary terminals on the base unit and it warms up. I read it in situ first and thought it was faulty but its looking like it is something to do with the temperature control circuit. The head unit was physically broken so I pulled the whole job lot apart to see which bits I could salvage.

I have been trolling the internet to see if I could find a circuit diagram for the station and head. No luck with the exact model numbers of base unit and head unit that I have (DS811D and DS3105 head unit) but I have found a circuit for a similar Weller model and three different wiring setups for similar Weller heads.

There are only three electrical parts for the head, the heating element that needs 24v AC, a heater control which is a PTC (positive temperature coefficient) device arranged as a probe that sits inside the element and a switch to turn the vacuum pump on. The pump is DC driven so the switch passes the 24v AC to a bridge rectifier, FET driver and then to a Thrystor trigger to drive the motor.

All are terminated on a small pcb which itself was partially damaged when the head was broken. I just have to figure out the right coloured wiring that is on my unit and rewire accordingly. I may have to disconnect the PTC and put a fixed resistor in but I do have heat and pump control so should be able to get a working head unit by rewiring.
Ian

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 38130
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Stanley » 21 May 2017, 10:22

Sorry about that Ian. But there you are, we knew we were on a hiding to nothing with the bastard size.... Best of luck with Plan 'B'!!
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

User avatar
PanBiker
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 6616
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 13:07
Location: Barnoldswick - In the West Riding of Yorkshire, always was, always will be.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by PanBiker » 21 May 2017, 16:41

Aye, best laid plans and all that. While trolling the internet for circuits I came across a Weller document that showed the tip data and noted that the threads were UNC. No pitch or other data though, the C is coarse is it not? that would figure.

Anyway I have ploughed on with a bit of back engineering trying to figure out which combination of the three wiring diagrams I have. I disconnected everything from the PCB and started again. Retested the heater with 24V AC and it was OK, I traced all the colour coded cables back to source on the 6 pin Latching DIN connector that couples the head unit to the base. I had a diagram that matched the colour regime exactly so I rewired the head unit PCB accordingly. The pump switch works but the heater doesn't. :confused: I went back to the DIN socket and found that there is a 24v AC line missing off pin 2 of the socket. There should be two 24v feeds but there is only one. I'm fairly certain that the head unit is rewired correctly so the next job is to see why I have no voltage on pin 2 where I need it.

Just goes to show, because the head was physically damaged, you get it into your head that the fault has to be there. I had 24v at the head but didn't realise I needed two separate feeds. Must be losing my touch, golden rule in bench servicing, check the supply lines.! If I had a digram of the base unit it would have been obvious straight away, working backwards it took a while for the penny to drop.
Ian

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 38130
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Amateur Radio Homebrew (Shack Culture)

Post by Stanley » 22 May 2017, 02:59

Just for a laugh, bring the tip round and let me do a test hole for UNC..... At least it would mean I can make you a usable converter.... You know how fast that is...... Worth half an hour as it gives you a plan B.
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

Post Reply

Return to “Amateur Radio”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users