Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 56036
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by Stanley » 09 Jan 2020, 03:10

I did the pic at Morecambe and you're right. Date is a mistake, should be 1961 I think.
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 09 Jan 2020, 03:45

Hi All,

Stanley, Christine, Bob and Chris


“Stanley”

I’m still reading your recent Forum articles on Elslack and Broughton extracted from Whitaker and I will report back here with any relevant info. Thank you for the picture of young John now in his 60’s I guess? And a pity we don’t have a picture of Jack his uncle (at this stage). I think it’s important to keep looking for John. Making him part of this review would be worthwhile for him, but Importantly he might just have the missing details that we seek in old fashioned “bits and pieces of paper” or letters etc. I’m thinking that if you grew up on a farm that had been occupied by your family for lets say seven generations, then someone in that time would have said or done something with the family history? May be an old family bible, diaries?

I’m working on a plan to locate John. Maybe someone on this Forum or in town might be able to help…..?

“Does anybody know where John Harrison (about 60ish) originally from Smearber Farm, Father Billy Harrison & mother Beryl Harrison) and Uncle Jack Harrison & mother Corrine Harrison who ran the Milk/Dairy and general trucking business around Craven area up to the 60’s and more recently living in Thornton In Craven lives now” ?


”Christine/Yazzy”

Regarding Smearber Farm and its current owners, it looks like this trail might not lead to historical documents by what you are saying. Wendy was talking about the Land Taxes and I was confused about these. Would these be Hearth Taxes? I have looked for land Taxes but all I can find is lots of figures for Elslack and no names, I wasn’t sure I was in the right place? Are you able to sort this out for us please.

I agree with you regarding the dated picture of Billy and young John, I’m going with born in 1955 and consider him to be in his 60’s now. I’m guessing that Stanly gave it to you!

”Bob”

Thanks for your valued comments and nice to catch up again after 17 years. It’s pretty easy for a Edmond Harrison descendant to establish who is at the head of the family, for us who have the Jeremiah’s in the lines it’s somewhat more difficult as you can see. I do have several wills, I stupidly only deciphered one of them and transcribed it properly. The others I did on the fly and I’ll need to look deeply at them again. But I will report the details in this domain in the next few days and let you all consider and help to decipher the details that I might miss.

As for Edmond being a Cooper, You’re right, I had forgotten that. That’s probably another hit to William, I seem to think as others do that these crafts stayed within the family, although Edmond is Francis’s uncle so I guess it’s in the family still! The “Coopers Cottage” is solved by Chris’s comment that the owner was named Cooper

“Chris”

Thanks for coming over and your valued comments, particularly the history of your travels and research with Bob at the Archives and how you located Edmund’s records and the state of the records, I had forgotten all those details and importantly the exact origins of our version of the PR’s and BT’s which have been invaluable to us all over the years.

As for the motives for the intentionally removed pages of the original register or intentional destruction and your suggestion that it could be an attempt to conceal evidence during property disputes/inheritance struggles and then we “draw a long bow” and see who was a Church Wardens during those times then I do think the worst….LOL

Church Wardens - Broughton All Saints.

1694 William Harrison
1996 Christopher Harrison
1707 George Harrison
1728 Francis Harrison
1729 William Harrison
1739 Edmond Harrison

And let’s not Forget the Vicar Ellis Nutter buried in 1728 after 48 years loyal service at Broughton All Saints, whose daughter married Jeremiah Harrison (Remember the three Nutter Y-DNA matches on the DNA comparison site that match our Harrison DNA (Looking forward to Gus Harrison’s sample analysis)..! (note to Chris: His Autosomal is different to ours, Y-DNA to come)

And your spanner in the Jeremiah works!

I had discounted Francis the Taylor because he was before the marriage of Francis the Cooper to Mary Greenwood, who is my contender, but seeing “Anne of Francis “Farrier”” that threw me. I went back to the BT’s and thankfully it was “Ann daughter of Francis Chapman of Broughton Farmer Bap Dec 5th

9.5.1734 - John of Francis of Elslack, Taylor
5.12.1734 - Anne of Francis, farrier (actually Francis Chapman)
31.7.1737 - George of Francis, Taylor of Elslack
17.8.1740 - Joseph of Francis of Elslack, Taylor
27.12.1741 - Jeremiah of Francis of Elslack
13.2.1742 - Charles of Francis of Elslack
8.8.1743 - John of Francis of Elslack
23.2.1745 - Mary of Francis
20.3.1747 - Joseph of Francis of Elslack
25.6.1750 - Greenwood of Francis of Elslack, Cooper

I'm off to read some Wills, "I've invited some more Harrison's and rellies to this review"

So the mystery continues!

Cheers Ian

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 09 Jan 2020, 04:26

Hi,
just another short grab at Whitaker's Craven.

The Harrison's at Broughton Church and how they were operating (Church Wardens) in 1577...

HISTORY OF CRAVEN. 83

he steeple is cočval with this enlargement. The South door has a circular but unadorned
Norman arch ; and the arch between the nave and choir is of the same form and date. The
whole building is small, and adapted to a parish consisting, at the last enumeration, of no more
than 172 souls; but it was once, and is still in some degree, interesting, by the figures and
armorial ensigns of the Tempests in the “storied windows.”—For, after a century and half of
neglect and depredation—after the stupid. “ improvements” of churchwardens
, and the topsy
turvy botch-work of glaziers, much of these fine memorials still remains, though mutilated and
It was most probably built by Sir Richard Tempest, Sheriff of Yorkshire 8 Hen. VIII. and on that occasion. Every arch,
moulding, &c, about it, resemble those of the first court of St. John's College, Cambridge, which is precisely of the same date.

defaced; but it is happy for the Antiquary that the whole may yet be perpetuated from the notes
of Dodsworth, who visited this church in 1621. For the little painted glass yet remaining in
the windows of our old churches, we are indebted to the oeconomy of the first Puritans, which
happily got the better of their ill taste and bigotry.

Hear how frigidly Harrison, one of the party, speaks on this interesting subject in 1577 “As for our Churches, they remain as in times past, save that all Images, Shrines, Tabernacles, Roodlofts, and Monuments of Idolatry, are removed. (So far all was well.) “Only the Storyes in Glass Windows excepted, which for want of sufficient store of new stuff, and by reason of extreme charge that should grow thorough the alteration of the same into whyte panes thorough the realm, are not altogether abolished in most places; but by lyttle and lyttle suffered to decaye, that whyte glasse may be provided in their roome.”

Seventy years after, the iconoclastic gadfly bit again, and with a fury which threatened to leave
no specimens of a delightful art, then almost extinct. It is now reviving in all its ancient beauty.
In the chancel window, Percy and Clifford (as the chief Lords of Craven). Tempest, A. a
bend, between six Storm-finches S. -
©rate pro b'no #icatbo &empegt et b'ma 3.12arg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
Wendyf
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 6320
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:26
Location: Lower Burnt Hill, looking out over Barlick

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by Wendyf » 09 Jan 2020, 07:18

Morning all. How confused am I by all this information!
As I understand it Land Tax was payable by landowners but these assessment books list all the parcels of land they owned and the tenants of that property plus it's value. This is a link to the records of Ancestry but you will need a subscription to see them.
As I mentioned before, there are just names of people, not the houses. Click on the year range on the right hand side.

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/5108/

There is a possible John Harrison on Facebook, looks the right age, HGV driver living in the Skipton area. The face also looks right!

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 56036
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by Stanley » 09 Jan 2020, 07:38

It would be nice if you found John, I have never forgotten him. I suspect he'll remember me as well.
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

User avatar
Wendyf
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 6320
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:26
Location: Lower Burnt Hill, looking out over Barlick

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by Wendyf » 09 Jan 2020, 07:58

Stanley, I'm going to email you a photo I've downloaded from his Facebook page.

ChrisHarrison
Newbie
Posts: 8
Joined: 08 Jan 2020, 18:12

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by ChrisHarrison » 09 Jan 2020, 23:12

Ian,

The Harrison of 1577 mentioned by Whitaker is a certain London priest William Harrison, a writer and observer, whose "Description of Elizabethan England" (http://public-library.uk/ebooks/43/52.pdf) seems to be one of the Whitaker's major sources.

I don't think the Puritan iconoclasm in Broughton can be laid at the hands of the Harrison churchwardens :biggrin2:

I'm glad the Francis's appear to be fewer than I had feared. That'll teach me to trust Bob D's scribblings, made when he wasn't wearing his reading glasses :laugh5:

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 09 Jan 2020, 23:12

Morning Wendy, Stanley, Et all,

Sorry Wendy I took off on a "All Saints Churchwarden" tangent!

I've spoken to John of Skipton (FB user) and he isn't the John of Billy Harrison, Albeit he believes he has family at All Saints Broughton. So he is onto that mystery. So the search for John of Billy continues.

On the subject of Land Taxes ill take a look, Yazzy is on Ancestry so she might be able to look at this?

On the subject of Wills, I'm onto the second which is the younger Jeremiah farmer of Carleton in Craven and this isn't helping and George's Will isn't helping either. I might look for some more. Given we know a lot more of the family since I got the three I have

Ian
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 09 Jan 2020, 23:25

G'day Chris,

Haha! That will teach me, I was thinking that William might have been the person who buried the Mary and child statue in the All Saints back yard (now reinstated) wasn't that text Broughton All Saints specific?

I'll stop drawing long bows about the Harro's. LOL.

Cheers

Ian

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 56036
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by Stanley » 10 Jan 2020, 03:17

I looked at Wendy's pic and couldn't see any resemblance....
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

ChrisHarrison
Newbie
Posts: 8
Joined: 08 Jan 2020, 18:12

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by ChrisHarrison » 10 Jan 2020, 04:56

Ian,

No, lad. It was generic. 'As for our churches', wrote William Harrison. He's reputed to have been rather a gossipmonger, and preferred getting his information from local aristocrats, Oxford academics and the clergy, rather than putting his boots on the ground and visiting places for himself. There's not much evidence that he actually visited very much of Craven, at all. Whitaker did a far better job of things.

I don't think there's any evidence for "our" Harrisons in Broughton or Elslack before the mid- to late 17th century. If I remember rightly, Edmund was appointed churchwarden on several occasions, including at the time of his marriage in 1736. Around the age of 28 he married Elizabeth Kendall, the recently-orphaned 15 yr old daughter of a pauper. I recall jesting with Bob D that it must have been a perk of the churchwarden's job (OK, I know, I'm bad...).

Later,
Chris

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 10 Jan 2020, 06:34

Chris,

yep! you were right, generic, buried within Broughton Specific info, I should have been more careful.....

Ok! one all now..... :extrawink:

Stanley, Wendy,

On John of Skipton, on the contrary, I thought he had "factor H genes" hands and ears showed signs of matching, AND he is a "Ham Radio Operator" Like Ian/Doc and I, so that has the makings of connections..LOL But Interestingly, he believes he has Broughton history in his Harrison family, so those "Factor H Genes" might actually be there. :good:

Ian

User avatar
Wendyf
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 6320
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:26
Location: Lower Burnt Hill, looking out over Barlick

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by Wendyf » 10 Jan 2020, 07:17

I'll ask a couple of my farming neighbours if they know anything about John. My hubby has regular chats with one of the Guy sons whose family still farm at Elslack but have land below us in Harden Clough, he might know something. :smile: There seems to be a community of retired local farmers who attend Skipton Market on a Monday for lunch and gossip..... I might be able to put feelers out there. :laugh5:

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 10 Jan 2020, 19:46

Hi Wendy,

That sounds like a great idea, thank you! The West Martin Dairy milk run in the 50"s and 60's might also ring a bell and the general haulage trucking business Jack continued to run after the ending of the Dairy Contract, might also help to identify the family. I guess its 60 years ago but I'm guessing that John continued to live and go to School in Thornton after the Business was sold etc.

I'm thinking that for the record, we should also mount here some other family details that specifically relate to identifying this section of the family in this community. So, here are my thoughts below. Please, feel free to change, delete, add edit, as required..


Farms that were occupied by the family:
• Elslack: Smearber Farm
• Carleton In Craven: Carleton Grange Farm
• Carleton In Craven: Carla Beck Farm
• Cowling: Leys Farm
• Thornton: Fence End Farm (possible)
• Thornton: Gubshill Farm
• Earby: White House Farm

Harrison's & research who/what we believe aren't related at this time:
• Phillip Harrison from Low Ground Farm Elslack ©1800’s
• John Harrison from Old Stone Trough Farm Kellbrook, recently deceased “lovely fellow”
• Bill Harrison’s "Gisbourne Harrisons" (Lancashire)

Occupations and/or Businesses (known) Ancestors in the Craven area ©1650’s to ©1960’s
• Dairy farms and farmers
• Cattle farms and farmers
• Cattle Dealers or Drovers
• Agricultural and farm Labourers
• Farriers and Horse related professions
• Butchers and Abattoir related businesses
• Milk and Dairy Products: Cheese, Cream, Butter Processors, Distributors and Retailers
• Skins, Hides, Leather products.
• We know some of the Harrison’s worked for the Tempests of Broughton Hall
• Coopers and Tailors

Where we look for known ancestors:
• The entire Craven area and anywhere in West and North Yorkshire, and beyond:
• Broughton All Saints Church is a place of significance where we believe this family centered it’s worship, registrations of Christenings, Marriages, Deaths and Burials from the ©1650’s onwards
• Broughton and Elslack area
• Thornton in Craven area
• Carleton in Craven area
• Earby area
• Cowling area
• Skipton area
• Barnoldswick area
• Colne, Marsden, Embsay, Kildwick, Huddersfield and surrounding areas

Medical Conditions “Genetic/Visible”:
• Dupuytren's contracture a hand deformity that develops over years. Affecting a layer of tissue that lies under the skin of the palm. As it progresses, the skin appears puckered or dimpled eventually creating a thick cord that can pull one or more fingers into a bent position usually the fingers farthest from the thumb. Sometimes referred to as “Viking Hand”

Harricroft
Newbie
Posts: 5
Joined: 10 Nov 2016, 20:35

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by Harricroft » 10 Jan 2020, 19:55

Hello, Chris. Other than her name, marriage details, and likely death, I don't know anything about Elizabeth Kendall. Do you have details of her birth and parents and if so could you let me have them. You must have been jesting with someone else. I don't know how different teenagers were in those days but the idea of marrying a 15 year old sounds like the stuff of nightmares not a perk!!

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 10 Jan 2020, 20:51

I was reading through the lists of Harrison Wills in the UK after engrossing numerous Wills that I hold without too much success!

I came across this entry:
  • "July 1740 Harrison ,_ "Harrison als (also) Chapman late wife of Francis Chapman of Broughton Ad"
I'm guessing this is Mary Chapman (nee) Harrison but I can't work out the reversion back to Harrison for a Will

There are hundreds of Wills in this listing, but none quite like this one (the form is unusual, may have been difficult to descifer ?)

Given that Chris identified this girl in his (Children of Francis Harrison list) "5.12.1734 - Anne of Francis, farrier", and we now know she was actually the daughter of Francis Chapman. Why or how did she get into the original Harrison BT listing? Why was Bob and Chris interested in this person?, was it just because she was a daughter of a Francis and slipped sideways into the list?

From the BT's 1734-1735: (Note: not in the Parish Register - Harrison version)
  • Francis Chapman and Mary Harrison both of Broughton being Farmer and Spinster married by Banns Dec 5th
  • Anne dau of Francis Chapman of Broughton farmer bapt Dec


I believe that Mary Harrison (Chapman) is the daughter of William Harrison and Edmond's sister, Christened in 1701 ?

I'm just interested in the dynamics as I intend to get this Will, it's the right period and it just looks unusual and that's always a good reason to follow a trail. Interestingly Francis Chapman and Mary Harrison appeared to get married and Christen their child Anne on the same day. Maybe they got a good deal $$$ I have seen mentions of Francis Chapman somewhere, suggesting that I have another Will somewhere? will report!

On the subject of getting Wills, I have previously purchased them on-line from the Archives but (now) are they available on-line at Ancestry or some other service? before I go spending up.!!!

Cheers

Ian

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 10 Jan 2020, 21:07

Chris and Bob,

regarding the issue of marrying a young girl. My William Harrison son of Henry (B-1825 Huddersfield) of Cowling who came to Australia in (c) 1850 and married Margaret Cameron (B-1826 Inverness Scotland) of Ewen Cameron of Mt Sturgeon Vic Australia and previously Inverness Scotland. Margaret died giving birth to her second child Henrietta. He retained the services of the daughter of the local General Store owner Paul Miller. Catherine Miller his daughter also of Inverness Scotland became the Governess of William's first child Mary Harrison. One thing led to another, Catherine, 16 married William 26 in Melbourne Scots Church and went on to have another 16 children .. Different times!

Ian

ChrisHarrison
Newbie
Posts: 8
Joined: 08 Jan 2020, 18:12

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by ChrisHarrison » 11 Jan 2020, 01:44

Bob,

As I remember it, we went to Borthwick to check out the Broughton BTs for Edmund. You ran through the film first but didn't find him. I looked at the film later, and found his baptism entry written sideways up the margin. I read on a bit and noted Elizabeth, dau of Simon Kendall in 1721. Then around 1736 there was the entry of Simon's death, where he is recorded as a pauper, followed soon after by Edmund and Elizabeth's marriage. When I noted her youth, I made the remark I mentioned. We also then pondered whether Edmund might have "taken her on" out of a sense of responsibility, given his position in the parish, and because he was already getting on a bit and needed to find himself a missus.

This is all from memory, since I don't have the notes in front of me. But if you have access to the Broughton BTs, it's all in there.

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 56036
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by Stanley » 11 Jan 2020, 02:59

I think Ian said nobody had any photos of Billy's brother Jack, the albino. This bit from my memoirs could be a clue, it was about 1961 I think. It's from Volume one of Stanley's Story on Lulu.com. There must have been pics of Jack when they bought Whitewell Dairy

"Billy had bought Jack out and taken the business over himself. Jack had joined a consortium that bought Whitewell Dairy at Accrington after WMD took the bottle loads off us and we were left with nothing but cans. He went into partnership with a man who lived at Stainton house who was a representative for UDEC (United Dairy Equipment Company) and another bloke, I think he was a Barlicker called Widdup. They must have known something because shortly afterwards they sold out to Associated Dairies who bought WMD as well and I have an idea Jack made a killing. Jack was fed up with Billy and the way he was running his life and wanted to get out but I have an idea that he felt guilty about leaving Billy on his own. I know we had a conversation and it seemed to me that he wanted reassurance that I’d stay on and keep an eye on Billy. I had no intention of becoming his brother’s minder but later that’s just what happened. Jack’s departure led to one interesting job outside the normal run of things. Billy came to me one day and said he wanted me to go to Accrington the following day and pick up a UDEC bottle washer at Whitewell Dairies and take it to Sandy Jones at Bow Street near Aberystwyth.
On the day appointed I turned up at Whitewell Dairies at 08:00 and up rolled Bradley’s crane. The washer was supposed to be eight tons and the crane regularly loaded heavier containers than this however, when he got hooked on and tried to lift it the crane wouldn’t have it. I should have smelt a rat then but rang Billy who arranged for Chris Miller’s to send a bigger crane from Preston the following day and off I went home. Next morning we tried again but it was no go, the overloads on the crane cut out and we were back to square one. I had a word with the driver and he said if we put a fiver under one of the front jacks this might cure it! I got the message, gave him a fiver and he opened up the lids of the overload breakers on the floor and held them in with his foot while he lifted. As soon as he had it high enough I backed under the load and we lowered it on to the flat. I had loaded it with the delivery end at the front as this was the heaviest part but when the wagon took the weight the front rose in the air about a foot. It was obvious that all the weight was in the back. I asked the driver to lift it while we spun it round but he said we’d have to wait for the overload coils to cool off so we went for a cup of tea. When I came back twenty minutes later he had gone!"
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

ChrisHarrison
Newbie
Posts: 8
Joined: 08 Jan 2020, 18:12

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by ChrisHarrison » 11 Jan 2020, 03:38

Bob

I found my own notes on the Broughton BTs

1721 Elizabeth, dau of Simon Kendall, labourer, bapt Feb 18th
1735 Simon Kendall of Broughton, daily labourer and poor, buried Feb 20th [father?]
1736 Edmund Harrison of Elslack Cooper and Elizabeth Kendell spinster of the parish of Thornton married by asking October the 26th 1736
1759 +Elizabeth Kendal of Broughton Aug 10th [mother?]

I haven't found any Elizabeth Kendal/Kendall/Kendell of suitable age in Thornton or any of the other Craven registers.
Only one small problem: "married by asking". If the father has died, and the girl is under 21, who consents to the asking, I wonder?

Cheers,
Chris

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 13 Jan 2020, 05:30

Hi all,

i've been away reading anything that I could lay my hands on that referred to the general Craven area prior to 1800's without any luck. I've been looking at Land Taxes as Wendy suggested and old Wills and Administrations as Bob has suggested and nothing is looking like it might help at this stage. There are some other Harrison centric discussions taking place elsewhere that might help and I will bring them into this discussion when appropriate and relevant

I went to a couple of major on-line Geaneology sites yesterday and was amazed to see so many trees with our Harrison family in them and nearly all having Jeremiah 1741 (son of Francis) and his ancestors at the head of the tree.. Amazingly, when I used the search engine on these sites I couldn't locate what I needed and often some or all of the details I hold, sourced from original documents, film, or Microfiche are not present in contemporary on-line resources. Naturally, it could be the combination of me and the search engine?

I admit, that if my sole source of information was these sites there would not be a choice of which Jeremiah to choose, William's Son Jeremiah 1740 doesn't exist on some sites, let alone the valuable additional information such as occupations etc.(I have been asked where this data come from)

Here is what I have. (Thanks to Bob and Chris many years ago)

BT's Broughton 1640-1742-3 Borthwick Microfilm
PR's Broughton 1690-1778 Northallerton Microfiche

From these two merged documents i have extracted the relevant info for us to determine the 2x Jeremiah's births including the parents marriages:

Black ** =BT's
Red = PR's

**1732-3 William H of parish of B, farrier, Martha Nutter of p of Th, married by licence June 4th
1740 Jeremiah son of William Harrison of Elslack bapt Jan 15th
**1740-41 Jeremiah, s of William H of Elslack labourer bapt Jan 11th

1740 Francis Harrison and Mary Greenwood of Elslack by banns Dec 25t
**1740-41 Francis Harrison cooper and Mary Greenwood spinster of Broughton, married by Banns Oct 13th
1741 Jeremiah son of Francis Harrison of Elslack bapt Nov 27th
**1741-42 Jeremiah, s of Francis of Elslack bapt Dec 27th

Notes:
1: No mention of William and Martha Nutter's Marriage 1732 in the Parish Registers (missing due to torn out pages)
2: Jeremiah son of William Baptised in 1740 Jan 11th in Bt's and 15th in Pr's
3: Jeremiah son of Francis Baptised in 1741 Dec 27th or Nov 27th

Marriage Information:

**1763 Jeremiah Harrison and Mary Clark of Elslack by Bans June 25th

Notes:
1: No mention of Jeremiah and Mary Clark's wedding in the Parish Register
2: No wedding for the second Jeremiah in the Broughton registers

Death:
../../..1802 Jeremiah Harrison farmer of Broughton (Death) ( PR's Broughton 1690-1778 Northallerton Microfiche) (an extra)?
26/12/1830 Jeremiah Harrison Smearber Farm (90 years - B1740) (Rg# 0125) (Broughton Burial Register 1813 1927 CRO Ref PR/BRT1/9)
19/06/1818 Mary Harrison (Clark) Elslack (76 years - B1742) Rg# 0038) (Broughton Burial Register 1813 1927 CRO Ref PR/BRT1/9)

Notes:

1: There are no visible graves for either of the Jeremiah's or Mary Harrison at the Broughton All Saints Church Yard, but there are entries in the Burial Register and Parish Records for their deaths, the assumption is that they are buried within this graveyard
2: The Mi's and the Burial Register don't agree, there are no graves for people (Harrison's) prior to (c)1800 the BT's and PR's describe at-least another 20 deaths before 1800 at Broughton?

Using the above Birthdates and Death dates for the two Jeremiah Harrisons, I calculate the following age at death:

Jeremiah Harrison born 1740 to William Harrison Christened on 11-15/01/1740 and buried on the 26/12/1830 = 90 years 11m 15days
Jeremiah Harrison born 1741 to Francis Harrison Christened on 27/11/1741 or 27/12/1741 and buried on the 26/12/1830 = 88 years 11m 29days

If anybody reading this has a photograph or details of the inscription on the missing Jeremiah and Mary Harrison gravestone at Broughton ASC PLEEEEEESE let us know about it!! (Also not in the Keighley and District FHS MI's 2001 register)

1/ The Jeremiah born to William Harrison (farmer) of Smearber Farm in 1740 has the right age at death (90 years) that the Broughton Burial Register describes and he was also a farmer from Smearber Farm.
2/ The Jeremiah Harrison born to Francis The Cooper would have been (88 Years) using the dates described in the BT's and PR's for his Christening and Burial

Hope this all computes? (Flame away)!

Ian

User avatar
Stanley
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 56036
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 12:01
Location: Barnoldswick. Nearer to Heaven than Gloria.

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by Stanley » 13 Jan 2020, 06:08

"No mention of William and Martha Nutter's Marriage 1732 in the Parish Registers (missing due to torn out pages)"
I noted that. Could it have been some idle researcher in days gone by? I've seen it done more recently but luckily I was able to put the situation right.
Stanley Challenger Graham
Stanley's View
scg1936 at talktalk.net

"Beware of certitude" (Jimmy Reid)
The floggings will continue until morale improves!

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 13 Jan 2020, 07:31

Stan,

that could be right,?

it could have been a researcher, but, the removal of the pages would have occurred before the original registers were given to the Parliament, as described in Thomas Dunham Whitaker's Book (The History and Antiquities of the Deanery of Craven in the County of York. Publication date: 1805)

There a couple of later editions and I can't recall which one i've got? I'll report back!

Ian

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 13 Jan 2020, 08:30

While there is so much discussion on these Broughton records or lack off, I just saw this list of holdings and it probably says it all pretty clearly,

(Note the IGI start in 1741)

Broughton Records

Deposited Registers (North Yorkshire County Record Office)
• Baptisms: 1671-1703, 1707-1710, 1740-1939
• Marriages: 1671-1703, 1707-1710, 1740-1849
• Burials: 1671-1703, 1707-1710, 1740-1927

Bishop's Transcripts: At West Yorkshire Archive Service, Leeds
• 1600, 1604, 1631, 1633-1640, 1661-1663, 1665-1669,
• 1671-1673, 1675-1678, 1682, 1683, 1688, 1689, 1691-1696,
• 1700-1711, 1713-1716, 1719-1830, 1832-1843, (1848-1854, 1856)

IGI Coverage:
• C 1741-1843;
• M 1741-1836

If anybody has some spare days, (2 weeks) then, I've got a great idea.. "A two week holiday in Leeds"

HarroOz
Newbie
Posts: 36
Joined: 02 Jan 2020, 11:05
Location: Torquay Australia
Contact:

Re: Craven Harrison’s – Jeremiah 1740 vs Jeremiah 1741

Post by HarroOz » 14 Jan 2020, 01:31

Hi all,

The documents that follow are the product of a paid inquiry undertaken in 1911 by Harry Speight for a Mr Smith of Bingley who wished to ascertain some details of Jane Dean and her Marriage to William Harrison B-1771 the son of Jeremiah Harrison B-1740. I have had these documents for many years and to some degree underpins this entire review.

Harry Speight was a well known Author and and a professional Genealogist (Private Detective in this case). Harry published (c) 23 books mainly about Yorkshire and the Craven areas. "https://www.goodreads.com/author/list/3 ... ry_Speight". In this case Harry requested Registry information from all the Parishes surrounding Earby, he did this by either Telegram to the Parish Vicars or viewed original documents in person. There are about 50 documents that describe this trail for Mr Smith. The second image shows the numerous documents that are part of this investigation. So, this was undertaken in 1911, using original documents and old fashioned methods with the Harrison Family giving details along the way (he wrote to some family members for inside help) (a bit like I'm trying to do here on this Forum)

The first image is the family tree that Harry produced to provide some perspective of his investigation. Obviously there is some time elapsed between when Harry did this investigation in 1911 and when William and Jane were married and farming together in Earby in the mid to late 1700's. Importantly this tree clearly describes William Harrison as the father to Jeremiah Harrison B-1740 and his Wife Mary Clark. Note, that Jeremiah's father is William of Elslack and as we have discussed previously from (C) 1670's this Harrison Family appears to have its core at Broughton and Elslack. The production of this Family Tree was not the subject of Harry's investigation, just a by-product. I believe this tree to be true and correct, I have checked and checked the details against all other resources that I have or have seen. This is my direct family, Henry Harrison (B 1804) to Jane Dean and William Harrison is my X2GGrandfather and buried at Broughton along with Jane and William in the adjacent grave.

What do you all think so far? With this information and the Birth/Death/Age calculation from yesterday's post? William has my support over Francis as the father of the Jeremiah who farms and has links to Smearber Farm and Elslack/Broughton?

Ian
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

Post Reply

Return to “Ongoing Family Research”