POLITICS CORNER

[Stanley]

I was thinking...... The problem isn't Brexit, it's the fact that we let the Tories get a majority. Voters get the government they deserve.

[plaques]

The parrots not dead, just resting. Speculation is running that Mrs May will be bringing back her deal next week. Part of the blame game for her losing the last vote was placed on Bercow for not allowing any amendments to her bill. The argument being that if one of the Labour MP's amendments had gone through then even more of the Labour Party would have voted for it. Ergo, Bercow's fault. She now waits to see if anything comes out of the Indicative Vote discussions on monday, possibly Corbyn's Custom Union suggestion, she could Hijack part of it and together with her dead parrot throw it in the air and pretend it would fly. Punch and Judy comes to mind.

[Stanley]

Who Knows P, that could well be the case. I have been listening to Tory MPs on R4 repeating the same mantra, it's all everybody else's fault and the way out is to vote the deal through. In other words, total denial of reality.
When a Labour Party spokesman made it clear he couldn't say what Labour would do if they got power until the Party considered that and made a democratic decision he was attacked. The impression is that the BBC has bought into the 'not me guv' scenario and is attacking everyone. Surely not..... The media bears their share of responsibility also.

[Stanley]

We are all still in the dark in the mushroom farm..... Hark! I hear someone coming with another bucket of crap the throw over us!

[plaques]

It looks like Mrs May will see what comes out of monday's indicative meeting discussions, try to bolt some bits and pieces to her own trilogy of failed deals then off to Brussels to negotiate for us. Well that puts my mind at rest.

[Stanley]

I've seen governments fall apart in the past but never on this scale or with such breathtaking arrogance in ignoring the disaster. The Tory spokes persons were reduced to saying that the trend was going the right way as the scale of defeat was lessening. Surely some sort of all time record for obfuscation.
Let's see, when exactly do all the lights go out?

[Tizer]

This episode of Any Questions is worth listening too. LINK As I do with Tony Blair, at present I find myself agreeing with Alastair Campbell. Peter Hennessy is always good value and he's so polite and balanced in his discussions.

Alastair Campbell, Lord Hennessy, Bronwen Maddox, Gisela Stuart.
Jonathan Dimbleby presents political debate from Dover Castle Keep with the journalist and commentator Alastair Campbell, the crossbench peer Lord Hennessy, the Director of the Institute for Government Bronwen Maddox and the former Chair of Vote Leave Gisela Stuart who is now Chair of Wilton Park, an executive agency of the UK Foreign Office dedicated to conflict resolution in international relations. As MPs reject Theresa May's withdrawal deal for the third time, the panel debate possible ways forward and Britain's future global repuation post Brexit.

[Stanley]

I heard part of it Tiz.... Still not sure about Blair and Campbell but I agree with what they say about Brexit. I missed news of the vote last night, went to bed early. I've read THIS BBC report and am now back up to speed. As my American army friends would say, SNAFU!
Under a presidential system we could now have an executive decree but whether that would be an improvement is debatable. Let us never forget who got us here and what went wrong.

[plaques]

So the Tories rejected all the proposals, surprise, surprise, this is the old political gaming manoeuvre to put the opposition in a bad light. It is particularly true where the motion has been forwarded by the leader of the opposition even if the final resolution is worse than the one rejected. The overall idea is to belittle the opposition leader and show them who is boss. This has been a parliamentary tactic ever since Disraeli used it with good effect on Gladstone. When is Mrs May going to put the country before the party? All the emergency meetings in No 10 appear to be about 'how do we keep the party together even if it means side stepping the real issues'?

[Stanley]

I think you are dead right P. Even when we are on the brink party unity trumps what is good for the country.
It is despicable and of course the big problem is our antiquated political system allows the party in power to do this. May has introduced her own refinement to this by taking all the decisions for her party.....

[PanBiker]

Another one of her ministers has jumped ship I believe, the whatever they call themselves gang are looking to convert themselves into a political party with their offshore bungs as backing. All options voted down last night but a Customs Union only by 3 votes I believe. How the Tory party can actually call itself a democratic party is beyond me. Effectively they have one person calling all the shots, in my book that's what we call a dictatorship isn't it?

[plaques]

Another one of her ministers has jumped ship

I watched this last night, Nick Boles did the honorable thing and resigned in front of the house. Nick Boles His stand was that his fellow Tories had made no attempt to compromise and felt enough was enough. Over to you Mrs May.

[plaques]

Mrs May latest offer to have talks with Corbyn. Corbyn has agreed to meet her for discussions. I have not seen any printed version of her statement but half way through she mentions "any plan would have to agree the current withdrawal agreement" Ie: agree to my failed plan plus some bits you can think of. The alternative would be "different options to put before the House to determine which course to pursue". This sounds more promising but I'm not sure when she talks about the 'opposition' whether she means the Labour Party or the Tory Party?

[Stanley]

And in order to make any of her wheezes work she needs more time. The EU are pissed off with her and will insist on a long delay and EU elections. Either that or tell her all bets are off. She has reached the depths now and we are on track for crashing out.
Oh by the way, RIP the Tory Party..... PS. The woman is barking mad as well as being an idiot.

[chinatyke]

Mrs May...but I'm not sure when she talks about the 'opposition' whether she means the Labour Party or the Tory Party?

[Stanley]

It's no laughing matter China. P is quite accurate, there are two Tory parties, one of them is the ERG.

[Stanley]

Angela McCowan of the Northern Ireland CBI has just been on Today and one phrase leapt out. She said "Sometimes I think that MPs who say no deal would be supportable have no understanding of Northern Ireland."
I think she's right. She was making the point that given the choice between No Deal and the Backstop NI industry choose the backstop.

[Tizer]

It's no laughing matter China. P is quite accurate, there are two Tory parties, one of them is the ERG.

Yes, and we have two Labour parties, so it's even worse!

I do feel sorry for the BBC. Rees-Mogg was complaining on the Today programme this morning that the BBC (and especially `Today') are `lefties'. At the same time they get accused by Labour supporters of being right-wing and of attacking the Left.

[Tripps]

PS. The woman is barking mad as well as being an idiot.

Welcome to the club.

I posted this on 10th June 2017 after her great success in the snap General Election.

"Mrs May made the same victory speech outside Number 10 which she had prepared for a win with a large majority. She then gave an interview, in which she gave the same answer at least five times to at least five different questions. This is now enough evidence, I would suggest, that she is now sectioned under the mental health act. "

[Stanley]

I remember.....
See THIS BBC report on what the retailers are saying. Food prices rose faster last month than at any time in the last six years. Imagine being a family living off debt, many of them in work. This is where the political energy ought to be going, not the narcissistic behaviour we are witnessing this morning.

[Pluggy]

It's no laughing matter China. P is quite accurate, there are two Tory parties, one of them is the ERG.

Yes, and we have two Labour parties, so it's even worse!

I do feel sorry for the BBC. Rees-Mogg was complaining on the Today programme this morning that the BBC (and especially `Today') are `lefties'. At the same time they get accused by Labour supporters of being right-wing and of attacking the Left.

Which suggests to me that the Beeb have it about right. Its left leaning which is pretty much where socialism and most of the qualiity press is at. Theres no suiting the right and the soft left. Rees-Mogg and Boris would be first up against the wall if I ruled the country.

[Stanley]

Exposure to scrutiny hasn't done either of them much good Pluggy. Surely even the Tories will realise they are both weird in their own ways.
Meanwhile the nation holds its breath as May and Corbyn talk. Crowd of rabid right wingers are frothing at the mouth. One even stood up in Parliament yesterday and described him as a Marxist leading an anti-Semitic Party. They are frightened of Corbyn. IDS standing up and describing him as a man 'unfit to be PM' was a bit rich. (Remember 'The Quiet Man' speech?) this from a man who engineered Universal Credit......
In another part of the forest.... I see that Grayling's management of Crossrail is coming under scrutiny. Over budget and over time.....

[plaques]

My view of the latest talks between Mrs May and Corbyn is that they don't look too promising. Talks on Brexit. It looks like Mrs May will insist on her deal with promises to consider other ideas after it has been passed. Coorbyn will of course reject this approach and has offered up his own customs union idea with a second referendum as second place. At least Corbyn has released some comment about the talks which is something Mrs May always appears to be reluctant to do. Meanwhile the can gets another kicking while the rabid rightwing Tories try their best to fix a negative image on Corbyn. This is getting ridiculous beyond imagination.

[Tizer]

On Today this morning Austria's foreign minister pointed out difficulties with the EU elections. If the UK takes part or doesn't take part, either way it raises problems with subsequent legitimacy of EU decisions and that has a bearing on Brexit. We've landed ourselves with a dog's breakfast.

Meanwhile look what's been going on...
`Facebook Brexit ads secretly run by staff of Lynton Crosby firm. Exclusive: ‘grassroots’ groups that spent up to £1m on targeted Facebook ads share administrator who works for lobbying firm' LINK
`A series of hugely influential Facebook advertising campaigns that appear to be separate grassroots movements for a no-deal Brexit are secretly overseen by employees of Sir Lynton Crosby’s lobbying company and a former adviser to Boris Johnson, documents seen by the Guardian reveal. The mysterious groups, which have names such as Mainstream Network and Britain’s Future, appear to be run independently by members of the public and give no hint that they are connected. But in reality they share an administrator who works for Crosby’s CTF Partners and have spent as much as £1m promoting sophisticated targeted adverts aimed at heaping pressure on individual MPs to vote for a hard Brexit.

`Repeated questions have been raised about who is backing at least a dozen high-spending groups that have flooded MPs’ inboxes with calls to reject Theresa May’s deal. Until now they were thought to be independent entities. But according to the documents, almost all the major pro-Brexit Facebook “grassroots” advertising campaigns in the UK share the same page admins or advertisers. These individuals include employees of CTF Partners and the political director of Boris Johnson’s campaigns to be mayor of London, who has worked closely with Crosby in the past. Their collective Facebook expenditure swamps the amount spent in the last six months by all the UK’s major political parties and the UK government combined. They have paid for thousands of different targeted Facebook ads encouraging members of the public to write to their local MPs and call for the toughest possible exit from the EU, creating the impression of organic public opposition to Theresa May’s deal.'

[Stanley]

"This is getting ridiculous beyond imagination."
You are quite right P and it's no wonder we are gradually producing a concord of EU members who are totally fed up with our approach.
Tiz. I didn't know that but it doesn't surprise me. I have long suspected that there is a group of supporters of No Deal who have one thing in common, they are all capital holders and stand to benefit from chaos in the same way the financial sector, particularly the banks, are making hay at the moment. I have always thought that Crosby is a vile man and should never be allowed to advise anyone on anything. (Apart from that he has a lousy track record!)
Give Corbyn his due, he continually reminds the House that it is the least wealthy and privileged who are going to pay the price in any economic downturn and the one thing that everyone agrees about is that 'there will be short term pain' (How 'short'?) if we crash out.
My forecast is that when May goes back to Brussels next Wednesday asking for her short extension she is going to be told that she can have more time but the the price is that we must hold EU elections in May and the extension will be anything from a year to two years.
As for the bipartite talks with Corbyn, the other parties are quite right to question why they aren't invited, particularly the SNP. As we continually point out in this forum (And have done since before 2016) these 'consultations' should have been done and a position agreed before the Article 50 letter was sent in. This isn't hindsight, I advocated a National Government to deal with the Credit Crunch in 2008 and Bruff pointed out the Irish problem long before it dawned on May and her crew.
The bottom line is that May and her ilk have never had the good of the country as prime consideration, it has always been a Tory Cat Fight. It started there and is ending up with it in spades. She keeps saying that anything other than blind adherence to Brexit a la referendum result will be a betrayal of democracy. The betrayal has been her acting like a dictator and completely failing to realise that once that letter was sent in, as I predicted at the time, the EU held all the cards and we were only supplicants.
What are the bookies saying about odds against the Tories in any election.......