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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 15 Nov 2019, 19:36
by Pluggy
Heres a little something I came across today that is pertinent to this thread on several levels.

This is a capture of a youtube video :

Image

Watching it I came across this bit and I immediately thought Stanley and the Bancroft engine. It isn't when scrutinised but it caught my attention.

The Video can be viewed here : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QLEERYS5C8

The Stanley double take is at 3:52

The whole video is interesting from a renewable energy / electricity / battery viewpoint.

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 16 Nov 2019, 03:10
by Stanley
Interesting video Pluggy. there's some very good stuff on Youtube hidden amongst the dross.
The floods in the Midlands arrived with perfect timing for those arguing for action and expenditure on fighting climate change.

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 21 Nov 2019, 09:10
by Tizer
If we can't get China to change its policies on building coal burning power stations at home and abroad then we'll just have to hope that the stations prove to be uneconomic and are shut down.
`Climate change: China coal surge threatens Paris targets' LINK
`While the rest of the world has cut coal-based electricity over the past 18 months, China has added enough to power 31 million homes. That's according to a study that says China is now in the process of building or reviving coal equivalent to the EU's entire generating capacity. China is also financing around a quarter of all proposed coal plants outside its borders. Researchers say the surge is a major threat to the Paris climate targets....
`The researchers say that through 2018 and up to June 2019, countries outside of China cut their coal power capacity by 8.1 gigawatts (GW). In the same period, China added 43GW, enough to power around 31 million homes. The authors say that right now the amount of coal power under construction or under suspension and likely to be revived is about 147.7GW, an amount that is almost the same as the entire coal generating capacity of the European Union (150GW). Compared to the rest of the world, China is building about 50% more coal plants than are under construction in all other countries combined....
`The researchers say that by 2030, China needs to reduce its coal power capacity by over 40% from current levels in order to meet the reductions required to hold global warming well below 2C. "China's proposed coal expansion is so far out of alignment with the Paris Agreement that it would put the necessary reductions in coal power out of reach, even if every other country were to completely eliminate its coal fleet," said co-author Christine Shearer of Global Energy Monitor. What concerns the researchers is that within China, coal and electricity industry groups are pushing for an even bigger increase in the country's overall coal power capacity. "The thing we are super worried about is that industry has actually organised to keep the whole thing going," said Ted Nace. "There are three different powerful trade groups, proposing to increase the coal fleet by 40%. This is sheer madness at this point." China is also busy financing coal development outside the country, funding over a quarter of all the coal plants outside its borders in countries like South Africa, Pakistan and Bangladesh.'

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 22 Nov 2019, 04:42
by Stanley
And Australia too I think Tiz.
I saw the same report, worrying stuff but of course we have to simply ignore it, carry on and hope they come to their senses. Increasing air pollution might help!

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 23 Nov 2019, 23:11
by Whyperion
In about 1981 I mused that China measured in GDP per head would only expand - presumably done at effective deficit financing and riding roughshod over its populace, as a consquence would be pollution beyond imagination (I only thought this would apply to Internal Combusion Cars - I sort of presumed Chinas Electricity would come from Nuclear and Hydro systems)

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 24 Nov 2019, 10:35
by Tizer
Well, this is a U-turn if ever there was one!
`And on that bombshell: Jeremy Clarkson is a climate change believer: The motoring presenter has lost any doubts about global warming after a grim epiphany on location in Cambodia' LINK
`Britain’s biggest petrolhead has admitted that he has no doubt about the existence of climate change after an epiphany on the other side of the world. Jeremy Clarkson, a long-standing critic of “eco-mentalists”, says he became convinced of global warming after being thwarted by the parched state of a river system in southeast Asia while filming for his television motoring show, The Grand Tour. As he tried to navigate 500 miles downstream from Siem Reap in Cambodia to Vung Tau in Vietnam with his co-presenters Richard Hammond and James May, Clarkson found parts of the once-mighty Mekong river system had been reduced to a trickle. Boats sat on dried-up lakes and aquatic wildlife had vanished from a region that is home to millions of farmers...'

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 24 Nov 2019, 20:19
by Whyperion
I think the river fed from mountain glaciers might be losing some flow from warming temperatures, but it is probably more human demand from rising population that is doing the most damage in most river flow (as opposed to lake shrinkage) situations

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 25 Nov 2019, 06:47
by Stanley
I heard that 'news' as well Tiz. Forgive me if I am a bit sceptical about Carlson having a Damascene Conversion. I get the impression that career-wise he has been struggling of late and this could well be a useful way to get back in the public eye.....

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 28 Nov 2019, 05:27
by Stanley
The latest assessments of sea level rise due to climate change caused by CO2 are dire. I can't help thinking that it is now unavoidable, I wish the politicians could accept the same message.
I heard a 'fact' during the discussions about meat and methane that surprised me. One scientist said that we were looking at the wrong gas because while methane degrades relatively quickly CO2 is permanent and can only be lessened by absorption in Water or vegetation. This is why he came down on the side of the argument that cultivating grass for grazing animals was the most affective way of locking up CO2, better even than re-forestation and producing valuable protein from grass which being largely cellulose is not digestible by us humans. Is this a valid argument?

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 28 Nov 2019, 09:38
by Tizer
His reasoning (or knowledge) is a bit dodgy. Methane is 30 times stronger than CO2 as a `warming' gas. Yes, it lasts for about 7 to 9 years whereas CO2 remains for much longer - but when methane breaks down in the atmosphere it becomes CO2 and water vapour, both of which are warming gases. So methane release is worse than CO2 release. See this from the US National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA): LINK

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 29 Nov 2019, 04:20
by Stanley
Thanks for that Tiz. Isn't OG wonderful!

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 30 Nov 2019, 10:12
by Tizer
Russia aims to boost its coal exports to India six-fold by 2025, to 28 million tonnes a year, by sending convoys through the Arctic sea. It's bad enough that Russian companies are messing up the Arctic by their state-approved activities but even worse that they are ignoring the state regulations and going ahead with unapproved mining in environmentally sensitive areas. And let's not forget that all this coal is going to be burned in India and add to the climate change problems.
`Russia's Taymyr plan: Arctic coal for India risks pollution' LINK

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 01 Dec 2019, 03:45
by Stanley
I become more and more convinced that despite all the words, we are going to reach a point where extreme weather events, sea level rise and other yet to be defined consequences of the effects of the Anthropocene Era will eventually prove that we need change and of course by then it will be too late. Mass migrations and extinctions are going to be horrendous and will affect all of us. That's the ones who are still here. I think of my children and their children's children. This isn't pessimism, it's realism.

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 01 Dec 2019, 16:49
by John Turley
HEADING FOR EXTINCTION - PRIMET COMMUNITY CENTRE, COLNE BB8 9NF THURSDAY 5 DECEMBER @ 7.30pm
A public talk by members of Extinction Rebellion sharing the latest climate science, the psychology around climate change and possible solutions. The talk is free and all are welcome. Click on link for further information.


Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 02 Dec 2019, 02:56
by Stanley
:surprised:

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 02 Dec 2019, 10:14
by Tizer
It would help their cause if the organisers of the ER event gave details of the speakers and their credentials so that the public would be able to decide whether to have confidence in what they say. And I say that not as a climate denier but as someone who has followed the debate for 25 years and is convinced of the need for action.

In the meantime, a little way from Colne...
`Climate change: COP25 talks open as 'point of no return' in sight' LINK
It's good to know that Nancy Pelosi will attend the Madrid climate meeting as a representative from the US. It's no good trying to get Trump there and he'd only tell lies and mess up the meeting. Perhaps we should send Jeremy Clarkson to America with the task of converting Trump? Mind you, `"While it's great Speaker Pelosi is coming to Madrid in place of Trump, symbolic gestures are no substitute for bold action," said Jean Su, from the US Center for Biological Diversity. "America remains the number one historic contributor to the climate emergency, and even Democratic politicians have never committed to taking responsibility for our fair share." ' :smile:

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 03 Dec 2019, 04:35
by Stanley
The tragedy is that force of circumstances will soon force all the deniers to recant but by then it will be too late.

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 03 Dec 2019, 10:58
by Tripps
Stanley wrote:
03 Dec 2019, 04:35
The tragedy is that force of circumstances will soon force all the deniers to recant
When you say 'soon' . . . .? :smile:

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 04 Dec 2019, 03:13
by Stanley
The changes have started happening already David. See the report on warmest decades from the UN and look at the incidence of extreme weather events. The experts keep leaving a window of hope open by suggesting there is still time for change but I doubt it actually. It took 200 years to manufacture the conditions necessary to trigger change and we're talking about reversing it in a decade.
I do believe that technology will save us from ultimate extinction but not be affective soon enough to stop the effects on the most vulnerable. The focus is beginning to shift from climate change to societal change. The present campaigns like Extinction Rebellion are a symptom of this.
Meanwhile, my gas CH is keeping me nice and warm thank you.

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 04 Dec 2019, 18:15
by Whyperion
India Probably does not need coal. (other than for industrial processes - can they be fuelled by other means ?) CO2 wise its probably offsetable, but India has other pollution problems.

XR Behavioural Change - Any Idea for Quick Wins ? Personally I think it is easier to attempt to protect the rainforest areas, possibly for China to persue Economic Development by less CO2 generating means, (Note Present and Prospective MP (Tory) on Radio 4 for consituency near Heathrow - we must expand heathrow for GDP increases and to protect and increase jobs in my area (a very Chinese answer in a way) - so big need to think about work , worth and net discounted value).

Is there a way to move Water, and Heat, around the Globe , from places of excess to places of (human) need ?

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 05 Dec 2019, 10:28
by Tizer
We already ship oil around the world in tankers and via pipelines so I suppose the same could be done with fresh water. The trouble is that the climate is shifting to summer droughts and winter floods so we'd also have to build more big reservoirs like we need big batteries to store electricity for when needed.

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 05 Dec 2019, 21:02
by Whyperion
There was a thought that Water has a less natural flow than oil and the cost of pumps was high. Storage aside, a logical movement within the UK is the canal system. But I was thinking more in places like India and from Europe to Africa. You probably only need to move a marginal amount and not a large amount to swing a difference

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 11 Dec 2019, 09:36
by Tizer
Whippy, they have a canal system in India - British engineers built them! :smile:

This news story linked below relates to something I've been warning about for 10 years or more. Climate change melting glaciers means the end of having a smoothed out flow of water from the high mountain regions. In the past the high winter rainfall in the mountains has been naturally frozen and stored in glaciers and snow and these acted as reservoirs, letting out the water gradually into rivers throughout the year. This ensured adequate irrigation of crops and and provision of drinking water and can be considered a major contribution to the development of human civilisation. With loss of the glaciers will come extensive flooding of the lowlands in winter and severe drought in summer, making the regions no longer habitable.
`Climate change: 1.9 billion people rely on natural 'water towers'' LINK

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 11 Dec 2019, 11:35
by chinatyke
Image
:biggrin2:

Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Posted: 11 Dec 2019, 17:13
by Tizer
Hundreds of millions of years ago the relationship between atmospheric CO2 and temperature was different because so many other factors were different too. For example the sun was much dimmer and most of the earth's continental surface was packed together as one big continent in the southern hemisphere which meant oceanic currents and heat distribution were different. You can't make valid direct comparisons with back that far unless you take the other factors into account.