CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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Cynically of course, tar sands are only economically viable whilst oil prices are high, so cancelling the pipeline probably makes economic sense when they are low.......
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley »

Or realistic?
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Tizer »

The good old US climate scientist James Hansen berating Boris - great! There's Joe Biden in America turning back Trump's mistakes and here in the UK Boris is doing a Trump. You couldn't make it up! :smile:
`Climate change: Boris Johnson 'risks humiliation' over coal mine' LINK
Boris claims we have to mine the coal for making coke to make steel. As I've mentioned before, in Sweden they are using hydrogen to make steel and they make the hydrogen using HE power. We could be doing that in Wales or Scotland (if we still have Wales and Scotland, of course :extrawink: ).
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley »

I don't think science is Johnson's strong point Peter. The steel makers would rather carry on just as they are rather than have to spend on new plant to use hydrogen and I think that's the inertia that is causing this. The steel industry is still balanced on a knife edge in the UK. I think that's the problem. Not a viable private investment, only way it could happen is by government financing and that isn't very likely.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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I'm glad to hear Carney agrees with us, on both the danger of climate change and the obvious action to take - make climate protection the boost to our economies worldwide...
`Mark Carney: Climate crisis deaths 'will be worse than Covid'' LINK
`The world is heading for mortality rates equivalent to the Covid crisis every year by mid-century unless action is taken, according to Mark Carney. The former central banker said the investment needed to avert millions of deaths was double current rates. But with governments ploughing billions into keeping economies afloat, a question mark hangs over whether the recovery will be green enough. The answer lies in smarter investment, Mr Carney said..'.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley »

I agree with Mark Carney and so will anyone with half a brain.
Question is how do you translate this obvious danger into political action? Are there any politicians driven by 'what is needed' rather than 'what is politically achievable'?
I am not holding my breath.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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On Thursday I mentioned here that in Sweden they are using hydrogen to make steel and they make the hydrogen using HE power. This eliminates the need for coking coal. I knew there was some research in the UK on a new way to make hydrogen and now I've found it's at Oxford University. Peter Edwards and his team have developed a method of converting plastic into hydrogen in a single step process. Waste plastics are broken into little pieces by blending them, and then the broken pieces are mixed with a catalyst of iron oxide and aluminium oxide. The mixture is heated using microwave energy and the catalyst releases hydrogen from the plastic. 97% of the plastic's hydrogen content is released in 30 to 90 seconds, leaving carbon nanotubes. The scientists believe the process eliminates our need for coking coal in steel-making. It even provides high-quality carbon, some of which can be used to ensure the correct carbon content of the steel. No need for a coal mine in Cumbria!
`Turning plastic waste into hydrogen and high-value carbons' LINK
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley »

That sounds like a complete answer to so many problems Peter! Why doesn't Johnson know about it.....?
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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`Cumbria coal mine: Climate tsar urged to quit over 'reckless' plan' LINK
`Climate tsar Alok Sharma, who will lead a vital UN climate conference in Glasgow in November, is said to be "apoplectic" over the decision to approve the mine.'
Stanley wrote: 08 Feb 2021, 05:12 Why doesn't Johnson know about it.....?
Yes, and why doesn't the leader of the local Cumbrian council know about it? I'll bet he does know but won't admit it. I read some of his comments yesterday and he's living in the past - he was claiming there was no other way to make steel.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley »

Someone somewhere is telling them but they aren't listening. Could the coal interests have bunged the Tory Party a donation? Only a thought.....
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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`Whitehaven coal mine plan to be re-examined by council' LINK
`Plans for a controversial coking coal mine in Cumbria have been suspended by the county council. Councillors will reconsider the planning application for a site near Whitehaven in light of concerns about climate change. The council granted planning permission to West Cumbria Mining back in October, and the government decided recently not to challenge the decision. But now the council has said it will re-assess the permission. Guidance from the government's advisory Climate Change Committee (CCC) in December recommended that the use of coking coal should be curbed by 2035, whereas the council have granted permission to dig until 2049. A council statement said: "In light of this the council has decided that the planning application should be reconsidered by the Development Control and Regulation Committee".'

`...local Conservatives, including Copeland MP Trudy Harrison and Copeland mayor Mike Starkie, have been supportive of the mine, especially as some of its produce will be able to be used by the UK steel industry. They said they were "dismayed" by the county council's move and added the area "needs" the £160 million of private investment and 500 jobs the mine was set to bring.'

I notice the company involved is called West Cumbria Mining (WCM) WCM but the major Shareholder and investor is EMR Capital Resources which is based in Hong Kong, Melbourne and the Cayman Islands EMR . WCM's web site is not up to date and it's news page doesn't mention that the council has suspended the plans. The `£160 million of private investment' mentioned in the BBC article would be better spent on developing the plastics to hydrogen technology of the Oxford scientists - why not set up a development centre in Cumbria and make it the world leader in this new technology. The county council live in the past and their lack of initiative isn't in the best interests of the local people.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by plaques »

Not being a chemist I don't know much about the process of converting plastics to hydrogen + solid carbon but it makes me think that although processes have been available since before WW2 of liquifying coal into heavy oils and high grade fuel for cars it could be just possible that by using the latest catalyst techniques and microwaves the process could go from coal to hydrogen in one move. As suggested by Tizer money should be going into developing the Oxford idea rather than add more and more greenhouse gasses.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley »

I saw the news of the reversal of the decision and noted that the people objecting were Conservative politicians. They are not affected by climate change of course.... :biggrin2:
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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plaques wrote: 10 Feb 2021, 12:39 Not being a chemist I don't know much about the process of converting plastics to hydrogen + solid carbon...
The explanation is in a link I posted previously but here it is again: Hydrogen from plastics
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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Tizer wrote: 11 Feb 2021, 10:29 The explanation is in a link I posted previously but here it is again: Hydrogen from plastics
Yes I understand that bit but I'm not familiar with what happens to the tiny catalyst particles and if they are recycled also what size are the plastic feed stuff. If the heat generated via microwaves to break down the plastic appears to be the key factor is this approach a cheaper that the existing coal to liquid methods?
Just asking questions and displaying my ignorance.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Tizer »

This is your man, Plaques. Email him and ask!
Professor P. P. Edwards FRS, ML.
peter.edwards@chem.ox.ac.uk
Telephone: 01865 272 646

See his page here: Prof P.P. Edwards
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by plaques »

Damn it ! The Arabs have already beaten me to it. Spending millions on trying to convert their oil into hydrogen. Similar to the plastic conversion only starting with oil.

Abstract
Hydrogen as an energy carrier promises a sustainable energy revolution. However, one of the greatest challenges for any future hydrogen economy is the necessity for large scale hydrogen production not involving concurrent CO2 production. The high intrinsic hydrogen content of liquid‐range alkane hydrocarbons (including diesel) offers a potential route to CO2‐free hydrogen production through their catalytic deep dehydrogenation. We report here a means of rapidly liberating high‐purity hydrogen by microwave‐promoted catalytic dehydrogenation of liquid alkanes using Fe and Ni particles supported on silicon carbide. A H2 production selectivity from all evolved gases of some 98 %, is achieved with less than a fraction of a percent of adventitious CO and CO2. The major co‐product is solid, elemental carbon.

Tizer, Thanks for the link
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley »

This is a good site for education and enlightenment! :biggrin2:
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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It's still better, wherever possible, to use renewable sources such as wind, sun and HE...
`The global race to produce hydrogen offshore' LINK
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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More from Roger Harrabin on the Cumbria coal mine. One of the arguments for the mine is that `using British coal would save the carbon emitted by shipping it from Australia or North America'. But he says the government's climate advisory Climate Change Committee `points out that 85% of the Cumbrian coal will be exported anyway, and every extra tonne of coal on the world market will tend to drive down the cost and drive up emissions.'

`Cumbria coal mine: What is the controversy about?' LINK
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Tripps »

Hot off the press - Decision to be re-considered

Not widely reported yet, but perhaps the chain was -

First Floosie (Green activist) - to Boris (bigging up trhe COP 21 meeting in Glasgow in November) - who has a word with Sir Humphrey - who tells the Cumbrians to forget about the Honours list if it proceeds.

:smile:
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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Drawing a parallel with Trump and the attack on Capitol Hill. Boris Johnson has suggested that we should be meeting a carbon target by 2050 but this is a free country and I'm not a dictator telling you what you can't do. Not me Gov. but you are the Gov. Am I? who would have thought that. I'll have a word with Carrie.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley »

Doing a U turn seems to be par for the course these days. I think you're right about Carrie David.....
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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Tripps wrote: 13 Feb 2021, 12:08 Hot off the press - Decision to be re-considered
Old news, Tripps, have a look back up this thread at 10th February! But thanks, anyway, I didn't know about the young activists mentioned in your link! :smile:
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley »

I've been watching the unusual wether in Texas and the problems it is causing. I have been listening to Jennifer Francis who is an expert on climate change and she says that the culprit may be changes in the Polar Vortex. (LINK) Well worth looking at the link, it has a lot to do with our weather as well. One thing that Jennifer said was that paradoxically, the severe cold weather in Texas is evidence of climate change and therefore of overall global warming. Complicated isn't it!
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