CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Tizer » 26 Jul 2017, 09:06

`Sea level fears as Greenland darkens' LINK
"Scientists are "very worried" that the melting of the Greenland ice sheet could accelerate and raise sea levels more than expected. They say warmer conditions are encouraging algae to grow and darken the surface. Dark ice absorbs more solar radiation than clean white ice so warms up and melts more rapidly. Currently the Greenland ice sheet is adding up to 1mm a year to the rise in the global average level of the oceans. It is the largest mass of ice in the northern hemisphere covering an area about seven times the size of the United Kingdom and reaching up to 3km (2 miles) in thickness. This means that the average sea level would rise around the world by about seven metres, more than 20ft, if it all melted."

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 27 Jul 2017, 03:41

The way things are going Tiz that should be 'when' it all melts, not 'if'. I'm a pessimist (or a realist!) and think that we have passed the point of no return. Gaia will have her revenge on us!
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 29 Jul 2017, 04:34

There was a very good hour long programme on World Service on global water usage and policy. We tend to forget about water but this is one of the many elephants in the room connected with climate change. It is already a serious problem and the outlook is bleak! Well worth a listen.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Tizer » 03 Aug 2017, 09:14

Another dangerous effect of climate change....
`Warming to boost deadly humidity levels across South Asia' LINK

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 04 Aug 2017, 04:13

It can be quite depressing if you sit back and ask the question "Is there any sphere in which the human race is doing well?" We couldn't run a piss up in a brewery, let alone a planet!
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by chinatyke » 04 Aug 2017, 13:07

Stanley wrote:
04 Aug 2017, 04:13
It can be quite depressing if you sit back and ask the question "Is there any sphere in which the human race is doing well?" We couldn't run a piss up in a brewery, let alone a planet!
That's very negative and I disagree with your sentiments. Actually we do pretty well.

"Let us be frank about it: most of our people have never had it so good"- said Harold Macmillan back in 1957, and now it's much better. Would you really want to go back to those days? I certainly wouldn't!

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 05 Aug 2017, 02:46

I was thinking in terms of this topic,looking after the environment and the planet China. I think even Harold would agree we aren't doing to well there.....
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by chinatyke » 05 Aug 2017, 04:33

Perhaps it is because we've never been as informed, and considered the need to do something, as we are now. Don't worry, maybe a great natural disaster event will cull the humans and cure the problem.

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Tizer » 05 Aug 2017, 09:06

All those fears of space aliens are mis-placed, it'll be the humans who destroy themselves. No matter what solutions scientists can come up with for keeping us out of trouble our future lies in the hands of diplomats, profiteers and war-mongers. Here we are in the 21st Century with all the technical knowledge we need to sustain our civilisation and yet humans still insist on fighting each other. I take solace in the words of Professor James Lovelock: "Human civilisation may end but Earth will continue". Perhaps the next civilisation will be woolly bears (tardigrades). I hope they learn from our mistakes. :smile:

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 06 Aug 2017, 04:02

James Lovelock said quite a while ago that he feared we had passed the tipping point and that disaster is inevitable.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 07 Aug 2017, 04:02

I was listening to a programme on World Service this morning in which people reported on their first reactions to watching a close up view of a total eclipse of the sun. What struck me was the universal expression of wonder and it struck me how curious it is that we depend on the radiated heat from a large electric fire 98 million miles away for the foundations of life.
My mind being what it is I then thought about climate change deniers and wondered if they had ever reflected on the paradox that such enormous forces could also be so fragile in their effects on us. This being the case, how can they refuse to admit that our puny actions like modifying the atmosphere by polluting it can lead to enormous consequences? Could it be that they are arrogant and are actually refusing to admit that our very existence is no more than a happy accident. I find this very sad and an indictment of our flawed humanity.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 08 Aug 2017, 05:39

One of the key indicators in any assessment of climate change is the levels of 'greenhouse gases' reported by individual countries. See THIS BBC report on the possible inaccuracy of this data. Without good data, initiatives like the Paris Agreement are impossible to enforce. Further, this gives ammunition to the deniers and further slows down any reduction.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Tizer » 08 Aug 2017, 11:31

Most of the `error' is under-reporting of greenhouse gases which means the situation is even worse than we thought. The word `error' is true for some cases but not for most - it's usually a failure to record or report certain gases emitted, rather than an error in actual measurement or in calculations.

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 09 Aug 2017, 03:17

And like all these things, they can never be better than estimates and educated guesses.....
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 28 Aug 2017, 05:23

Is it my imagination or are the deniers keeping quiet as they watch hurricane Harvey and 50" of rain in a few days?
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by chinatyke » 28 Aug 2017, 07:40

There is an article in today's Daily mail online that states it is a once in a decade incident and would take years to recover from the damage. Later in the same article it said it is the worst since records began. Believe what you want!

I don't deny climate change, but can you blame climate change for a one-off event?

Throughout history the evidence shows that the climate has changed. I don't agree that taxing carbon will stop it or the little CO2 produced by mankind will cause such a big effect. Learn to live with it and move away from the coast!

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Christian » 28 Aug 2017, 21:46

I'd go further to say its a one in a century to half a millennia event in Houston. I've been watching their local news broadcasts( http://abc13.com/live/ , http://www.fox26houston.com/live) for the past couple of days and its incredible, 9 Trillion gallons of water. Its currently forecast to continue rainfall till Friday.

They have started a controlled release of two reservoirs at a cost of further flooding downstream to save further damage upstream and a possible dam wall breach. Their mayor does seem quite personable from what I've seen and have just explained what they are doing is pretty much by ear.

Edit to add: Their was minor criticism to why a mandatory evacuation was not carried out initially. The response was "Where can you put 6.5 million people?" .

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 29 Aug 2017, 03:52

China, what strikes me is that the incidence of extreme events is growing. Otherwise I agree with you, move to high ground!
Christian I've been watching the news feeds as well. The Americans have many faults but when I compare the straight talking of the officials to the guarded statements we get here with legal liability always a factor I think we have a lot to learn from them.

Image

Procter's furniture shop in Walmsgate after the July 1932 flood......
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by chinatyke » 29 Aug 2017, 06:26

This is what you call an extreme event and climate change:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... wball.html

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 30 Aug 2017, 04:16

That's a typical example of the terrible standard of reporting on science. A hodge podge of vague true facts cobbled together to try to be sensational. Go back a bit further and we were specks of star dust but it's got nothing to do with our current problems of over exploitation and pollution which are accelerating natural variations.
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 05 Sep 2017, 05:43

See THIS for an NBC report on the next hurricane to hit the southern US. It is confidently expected that the Category 4 storm will strengthen as it hits the warmer waters off the coast. All right, this isn't evidence of global warming or climate change but if the frequency of these events increases it's going to pose some awkward questions for the deniers. I'm glad we don't have to face them!
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Tizer » 05 Sep 2017, 18:56

It's now widely accepted that the extreme weather events are so extreme because they are superimposed on top of the effects of climate change and they are exactly what you'd predict to happen as the Earth warms. They're predicting Irma to have wind speeds of 180 mph.

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 06 Sep 2017, 03:50

That's a Big Wind! Glad we don't have them.
See THIS for an account of a big wind in Ireland. Take particular note of the entry on legacy. Many had no birth certificates and so a question was asked after 1908 to establish age, "Do you remember the Big Wind". It soon became obvious that this had been rumbled and they had to stop using this easy question because everyone answered "Yes" and described the wind.....
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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Tizer » 06 Sep 2017, 08:49

The storm that wrecked half the ships of the Spanish Armada is reckoned by some to have been one of the biggest on record. What's mentioned less often is that Drake set out with an English fleet to take revenge but his own ship was almost sunk by a storm and he lost about 11,000 men for little gain.

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Re: CLIMATE CHANGE AND GLOBAL WARMING

Post by Stanley » 07 Sep 2017, 03:36

Hurricane Irma is now said to be the worst since 1926 with winds over 200mph round the eye. It's heading for Florida and the expectation is that it will lose none of its power as the sea temperatures are elevated. Interesting that at first the reports were of 'the greatest storm in history' but someone must have done a bit of research, the 1926 hurricane season was a biggie. (LINK)
Keep your eyes on Hurricane Jose which is developing in mid Atlantic. Sea level temperature near Bermuda is over 30C and the meteorologists are quite worried by this one and its companions as well....
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