BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by PanBiker » 26 Aug 2017, 10:07

Waite a minute, it gets worse. My new policy kicked in yesterday (Friday), bought and paid for on Tuesday. I was given access to the documents online which I downloaded then printed the certificate for my car stuff folder.

I got a courtesy call from my new insurers to tell me that my policy had started, the guy ran through the benefits and pointed out to me to how I could contact them in the event of a claim. He then thanked me for my payment which had been processed but then added that there would be an extra £50.00 taken from my credit card next month! This apparently was for a claim I had made in 2013 which I had no knowledge of.

"Hang on a minute, what claim" says I. He then explained that the national database that holds insurance data had shown that the charge related to a claim that I had made in 2013. This didn't ring any bells with me as I certainly had never received any compensation or anything like that. Then the penny dropped.

May 2013 I was sat watching the TV when I heard a commotion and a lot of shouting and banging in the back street, my car was parked on the gable opposite. I went out into the street to see a couple of my neighbours chasing a bloke in an estate car that was weaving its way past all the parked cars colliding with quite a few on the way. When the bloke who was clearly drunk reached the bollard at the end of the street down into Valley Gardens he shoved it into reverse and continued the mayhem backwards. Eventually one of the lads on the street managed to reach in through the window and snatch the keys from the steering column and bring the joy ride to a close. He tried to get out of the car but he could hardly stand up let alone do a runner. Someone had called the police and they turned up a few minutes later. It transpired that the bloke was Polish, no licence, no insurance, car wasn't taxed and he was 6 times over the limit.

He had damaged six cars, mine included but no one had any recompense, we were all advised to notify our insurers of the circumstance and it was up to ourselves if we wished to claim on our own policies. I notified but did not claim, the damage was cosmetic only with a slight dent and scuff marks on the rear quarter. There was also the possibility that if I did claim, daft as it seems the insurers may have written it off. The car was 5 years old at the time but a single owner low mileage diesel (28k) and was worth more to me with the scratches.

So the fact that I rang my insurers to advise them that my car had been damaged while parked has turned up 5 years later as a claim and an excuse to charge me more money. That information has been on the database for 5 years and has never impacted my policy before.

The insurance company still intend to take the money, the circumstance is of no concern just the black mark. I cant refuse to pay or the policy will be cancelled for non payment of premium. I will also get a penalty if I cancel the policy. I will let them take the payment then take them to task.

I'm afraid I lost my rag on this call and remember mentioning pirates and con men during the conversation. I didn't directly abuse the bloke that called me though and did say that I appreciated that it was not his fault just the system that he worked in, he was somewhat sympathetic to my tone and I'm sure I'm not the first to "lose it" on the phone, all recorded of course so fairly sure there is some rule somewhere that they can invoke to shaft me a bit more if they want to. I think my original judgement of the types that I am dealing with was about right. I had to terminate the call to calm down before I started hyperventilating!

I'm sure your'e right about getting rid of the car but I'm not ready yet.

Pleas don't quote Harold Macmillan. :extrawink:
Ian

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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Stanley » 27 Aug 2017, 02:46

I shall manufacture a new Stanley Quotation for you Ian.

"Never underestimate the greed and stupidity of an insurance company."

What a bunch of shysters......
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by PanBiker » 27 Aug 2017, 08:49

It begs the question why, if was on the system since 2013 is it only now that they are beating me with it? I shall be looking at the online selling cooling off periods in the T&C's. I will let them take the payment to avoid cancellation and then take them to task
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Stanley » 28 Aug 2017, 03:25

There'll be an algorithm on their system looking for ways to impose penalty payments..... It has no brain and no heart.
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by PanBiker » 28 Aug 2017, 09:48

I have been doing a bit of research regarding the charge and I may have to live with it. It's the CUE (Claims and Underwriting Exchange) database that holds the information. This is repository used by financial and insurance sectors to record information on claims regardless of whether or not compensation was paid out. Insurance companies may or may not consult it when a new policy is taken out. Direct Dial obviously do.

If you think the information on the database is wrong you have to apply to the original insurer, company or institution that put the data on CUE and ask them to remove it. You can then ask your new insurer to recalculate your premium. The information is covered by the data protection act so my current insurer cant reveal which insurer actually put the information on the database. This is a problem as I cant remember either, it wasn't Hastings as I started with them in 2014 as the welcome letter and renewal notices are still in my account on their website. As usual when I change insurers I dump all the old stuff shortly after establishing a new policy with a new company. I cant remember who I was with in 2013, best guess is the AA. I can find out, as I can apply directly to CUE for what data they hold on me but I will have to pay a fee which is normal practice, it's £10 in this instance. If I do this there is still the chance that the original insurer will refuse to change the information. I can cancel the whole job lot within 14 days but would have a cancellation fee of £38.00 as the policy has started and the insurance company is legally entitled to charge for the first months cover.

So it looks like I have to accept the hit. The moral of the story is, if you are not actually going to claim don't talk to your insurers. :sad:
Ian

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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Tripps » 28 Aug 2017, 11:13

PanBiker wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 09:48
information on claims regardless of whether or not compensation was paid out.
That seems unfair. How can ' for information only' be regarded as a claim when no 'claim' has been either made, or made and rejected, and no payment is made. I guess loosely - the fact that the incident took place at all shows that there is a risk of it happening again with more serious consequences, but the link is a bit tenuous.

You have my sympathy. I'd try a 'talkathon' with the company. Complain, and keep talking, and asking for escalation to a more senior person. There may be discretion higher up for a goodwill refund. I doubt they are allowed to hang up, and you'd soon use 38 pounds worth of their time, which might afford some satisfaction. You'll certainly feel a lot better for it.

I once got through as far as the P.A. to the Chairman of the Halifax before I was repelled. :smile:
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by PanBiker » 28 Aug 2017, 11:45

I may well do that yet Tripps and argue the point that they should have done the search before giving me a price. I bought and paid for the policy in all good faith at the price offered which I accept as a contract which should be binding both ways at the point of sale.
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Tripps » 28 Aug 2017, 12:18

PanBiker wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 11:45
I bought and paid for the policy in all good faith at the price offered which I accept as a contract which should be binding both ways at the point of sale.
I totally agree Ian. That occurred to me also after I did the post. Doesn't sound kosher to me. Trouble is they probably have a team of lawyers behind them who said it's OK. Despite that - I think you will win this one with a bit of persistence. :smile:
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Big Kev » 28 Aug 2017, 14:16

PanBiker wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 11:45
I may well do that yet Tripps and argue the point that they should have done the search before giving me a price. I bought and paid for the policy in all good faith at the price offered which I accept as a contract which should be binding both ways at the point of sale.
There'll be a disclaimer in the small print that will cover them for 'errors and omissions' after the fact...

It's all a big con as it's a legal requirement to have car insurance in the UK.
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Marilyn » 29 Aug 2017, 00:09

i feel for you Panbiker, but don't really understand why you chop and change insurance companies so often.
I have had all my insurances (home/contents, cars) with the same insurer for 40 years. I get multi-policy discounts and loyalty discounts (and now my husband gets a "senior's discount too). I have only ever made one claim on the car (brilliant service and both the car and phone box I crashed into were fixed within days. I fell asleep at the wheel driving home from night duty, crossed onto the wrong side of a country road and landed in a phone box! I "totalled" the phone box... :surprised: ) and one claim on the house (when our internal hot water storage heater ruptured and flooded the entire bottom floor of our home).
I pay my insurances annually, which is also cheaper. i really have no complaints.

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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Stanley » 29 Aug 2017, 03:33

As I have said so often, it's the changes that spark off things like this and I have decided that apart from normal common sense checks it's best to stick with the devil you know and keep quiet. I know this doesn't suit everyone but I often wonder, in the grand scheme of things, if overall any savings are made..... One thing is certain, my way leads to a quiet life!
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Big Kev » 29 Aug 2017, 05:58

Shopping around saves me £100s every year. I did read an article the other day that said Aviva are going to 'reward' repeat customers, I'll let you know if that happens next February.
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by PanBiker » 29 Aug 2017, 08:49

I tend to change when a given insurer or supplier starts hiking their prices upwards above inflation for the same product. Loyalty discount doesn't seem to apply over here in the UK but it should. How many times do we see offers for new customers that existing customers of many years can't get their hands on?

My last insurer said on their renewal that as I had been with them for a number of years I may well be able to get a better quote elsewhere so I looked. I always give the existing supplier the opportunity to reduce their quote which sometimes works but not always as was the case this year. Regardless of this blip with the extra payment on this policy, (yet to be finalised). I have ended up with two better products in both motor and travel insurance both for less money so what is the problem with shopping around?

I also get 2 for 1 at the cinema for 12 months which is a bonus, not a game changer by any means but we do visit the cinema a few time a year and I will enjoy paying half as much as it normally costs us. We are going tonight on a 2 for 1 courtesy of Serge and Alexander. :smile: Oh, and I will save another £150 by not having to renew my AA membership. Worth a bit of shopping round I reckon.
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Marilyn » 29 Aug 2017, 09:13

My AA membership is with the same insurer ( multi-policy discount), and I am not interested in bells-and-whistle crap like cinema discounts or a set of steak knives. Our local cinema has deals on all the time, including meal/cinema deals or half price viewings ( which we enjoy).
It's the same with health insurance. I don't want gym membership and other useless rubbish.

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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by PanBiker » 29 Aug 2017, 09:29

Looks like you have it all Maz, unfortunately we have to find the best deals. However I don't have to buy heath insurance (not just yet) or have a need for the gym I have plenty of hills to go at and they are all free. Our cinemas tend not to do freebies so the Meerkats crap as you put it is still a bonus worth having.

I cant see why you are so upset about my efforts, you are on the winning side of the planet by all accounts.
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Big Kev » 29 Aug 2017, 09:32

My car insurance, travel insurance, home insurance and life insurance are all basic policies, it's just the comparison site that offers the 2-4-1 cinema tickets.
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Marilyn » 29 Aug 2017, 09:43

Not upset, Panbiker. I see the rubbish ads on TV and wonder who would take them up.
I've had Private Health Insurance since I was 17 years old. ( nowadays you have to have it here from age 40 or pay a premium for every year you delay after age 40. It is a compulsory thing, linked to annual income. When I say it is compulsory from age 40, what I mean is that every year you choose to delay after age 40, incurs a penalty premium, which ultimately you cannot avoid...unless of course, you remain a low income earner all your life!. But if you choose not to take out health insurance, and you earn a good wage, you will be taxed for health insurance on your income tax annually without any of the benefits or choices available to those who take out insurance. Eventually you find yourself paying so much at tax time with only access to the public system, that you may as well have private insurance/choice of Doctor/hospital and a glass of wine with your meal in a private bed, private room, private hospital. I would have to check, but I think the penalty is 5% a year after age 40. So if, say,, you join at 45 years, your premium ( as I have been led to believe) will ALWAYS be 25% higher than a person who joined prior to age 40. ( I've never had to worry about it, because I joined at 17)
No one LIKES to pay insurances at all, but it is the choice you make for peace of mind, of course.
( and I have seen our kids spend more on a night at the pub than I pay on insurances for a month. You can't put old heads on young shoulders but they are all settling down now and changing their attitudes).

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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by PanBiker » 29 Aug 2017, 10:32

Big Kev wrote:
29 Aug 2017, 09:32
My car insurance, travel insurance, home insurance and life insurance are all basic policies, it's just the comparison site that offers the 2-4-1 cinema tickets.
So are mine Kev, all I did was use the Meerkats to compare what was available, you always complete on the vendors own page and so it was with both of these policies. In this case it just so happens that Direct Dial is part of the same company that runs the Meerkats. It wasn't the absolute cheapest by any means but had the features I wanted and was still less than my previous insurers were offering. No loyalty discount at all from them.

Your Aviva promise for next year, good luck with that. They are formerly Norwich Union are they not? The very same that refused my claim for a side impact collision whilst stationary. Front impact damage on the other car, side impact on mine and they said I drove into her! We bend the laws of physics on occasion it would seem.

I'm glad we still have the NHS and don't have to have private medical insurance. I will put my efforts into defending to the best of my ability that we retain free medical treatment at the point of need. I don't need a glass of wine with my meal in hospital.
Ian

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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Marilyn » 29 Aug 2017, 10:49

Fair dues. Our public system is excellent too...if you want to wait 18 months for a new hip or knee.
And what will you do when there are a few million more of you paying nothing and expecting so much from a free system?
Surely, it is self limiting?.( I think it is unreasonable to expect cradle to grave health care as time goes on.)

No. I don't expect a glass of wine while I am feeling seedy enough after surgery either...or a free newspaper...( though hubby is the only one using our cover in the last 25 years and he quite likes the free newspaper...and little glass of red). But with his doctor a direct dial away he recovers well.
( and I have to add there, that he has had some very serious medical problems/ICU admissions for Cardiac problems/triple bypass/ cardiac and limb stents and almost fatal Septicaemia. So we are not talking about sitting up in bed having a wine after having his toenails trimmed!)

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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Stanley » 30 Aug 2017, 03:49

"I think it is unreasonable to expect cradle to grave health care as time goes on."
Couldn't disagree more Maz. That was the promise and over the years we have paid billions for the privilege through taxes. The answer is to prioritise spending properly. Less on vanity projects and wasteful political exercises and more on society. We are a wealthy nation but incredibly badly managed....
See THIS for a report by Citizen's Advice that one in five of credit card holders with arrears has been given an increased credit limit more than those in credit. This is a cynical ploy to keep debt and consequent interest rising. They are going to screw as much as possible out of these customers.....
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Big Kev » 30 Aug 2017, 07:39

Stanley wrote:
30 Aug 2017, 03:49
See THIS for a report by Citizen's Advice that one in five of credit card holders with arrears has been given an increased credit limit more than those in credit.
I paid for my holiday on my credit card a few weeks ago then immediately cleared the balance (I like the cover the card offers on these type of purchases), I am now being offered an increase on the credit limit. It's not a small increase either...
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by PanBiker » 30 Aug 2017, 09:13

I have letter from my new insurers today regarding the information held on the CUE database. The interesting thing is that it was Hastings that put it on the database. I can still get on my account online with them, or I could the other day. I'll go and have a furtle online to see if there is any information on claims there and if no joy will do the carousel and ring them to see if they will take it off. I have till the 6th September before Direct bump me.
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Stanley » 31 Aug 2017, 03:24

Good luck with it.....
I tried to lower the limit on my credit card but never succeeded. I can still go out and buy a car with it!
It seems to me to be a cynical greedy move to extend someone's credit when they max their card. This means there are no automatic sanctions and the interest payments increase. No wonder credit card debt is rising!
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by PanBiker » 31 Aug 2017, 09:03

I went online yesterday and onto my account with my old insurers. There is a live chat option so I took it, had a nice few minutes with someone called Ajib who eventually that (he/she) could not help me, did give me a number to ring into the claims department though. I rang and followed the "other" path until I got to a human. Dave told me that it would be illegal to alter the information on the database and so it was a no to my request to have the errant entry altered or removed, apparently its a prehistoric database with entries carved in stone a la Fred Flintstone and Barney!

Weasel words from both parties I reckon as the insurer wanting to charge extra says its perfectly OK to ask for details to be altered, it is at the behest of the organisation that did the entry. Go there and you are told it cant be done, it's against the law. I reckon it's actually more of a won't rather than can't, anyway it's not going to happen. I asked if they would confirm in writing that I had never made a claim during my time of being insured with them and he agreed this would be the best course. He emailed me the documentation shortly afterwards.

I have written to my new insurers enclosing the written confirmation of no claim and pointed out that the entry in the database (as shown on their letter to me) shows: At Fault: No - Claim: No. I sent it by first class post yesterday, they should get it within the week. I think it now rests on whether they will whack me for non disclosure rather than the actual entry or circumstance. I did point out that the proposal form asks for claims and does not mention having to reveal a courtesy notification. It's gone to the head of the claims department as his name and monica was on the letter to me, we'll see.
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Re: BEWARE! THE BANKS ARE OUT TO GET YOU!

Post by Marilyn » 31 Aug 2017, 09:14

You have done your best...

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