DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by chinatyke » 24 Nov 2017, 04:39

Stanley wrote:
24 Nov 2017, 03:51
Perhaps something to do with the fact that there is the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People.
Once, when I was talking to my eldest daughter who is a lawyer, I said one of my workers is a Paki. She was horrified and told me I couldn't call him that. I said OK, a coloured person. Again she was horrified and said I should refer to him as black not coloured. "But he is brown not black" I said. I hadn't said anything derogatory, just shortened Pakistani to Paki. The correct term is Mongoloid, with other races being Negroid and Caucasoid. What would he say if I called him a mongol? Do we object to being called Caucasian? Call a spade a spade...

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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 24 Nov 2017, 07:34

It's confusing isn't it. What's the position on 'Tyke' for somebody from Yorkshire?
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Tripps » 25 Nov 2017, 12:45

Well - I've tried rasher and tyke, but failed to get anything on their origin. Found that tyke refers to the accent as well as the natives - I never knew that.

It struck me that when I went to Ireland, bacon was always referred to as rashers.

Got a new word yesterday from Nigel Short (Chess Grandmaster - The lad from Leigh).

Try - Ultracrepidarianism

Very little of it on here - in fact (thank goodness), quite the opposite. :smile:
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 26 Nov 2017, 04:08

Webster says 'rasher' first noted in 16th century, origin uncertain.
'Ultracrepidarianism', I think you're right David, not something we go in for..... (I had to look it up....)
I have always associated 'tyke' with stroppy little mongrel dog. Perhaps that was the connotation.
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Tizer » 26 Nov 2017, 11:14

Stanley wrote:
26 Nov 2017, 04:08
'Ultracrepidarianism', I think you're right David, not something we go in for..... (I had to look it up....)
It's outside my knowledge, so I won't make any comment. :extrawink:

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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 27 Nov 2017, 05:24

Nice!
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 30 Nov 2017, 06:47

Funny how words sometimes grab you and raise a question. Today it is 'Pennines'..... I looked it up and the most likely explanation is that it comes from the Celtic 'Pen' as in Pen y Gent, a hill summit. The Celts were also a common tribe in the area of another mountain range in Europe, the Apennines and this explanation of origin could apply there also.
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 09 Dec 2017, 07:11

A chance mention in Kipling's 'Puck of Pook's Hill' sent me on a furtle....
Kipling says that the origin of 'hurrah' is a cry of acclamation to Thor the Scandinavian God. All the origins I have seen mentioned tend towards it being a cry of acclamation used by German and Scandinavian troops during the Thirty Year's War. It started as 'huzzah' and came to English from there.
However, I have a lot of respect for Kipling and his use of words and would like to think he knew something that had escaped the dictionaries!
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Tripps » 12 Dec 2017, 21:57

Just been on the phone to Uncle Jim who is from Preston - he used the phrase can't make moss nor sand on it" which I've never heard before, though the reference says it's common in the North of England.

He also said that Jan Leeming was 'bowling at t'fence' in a TV programme yesterday - meaning she was on the lookout for a man. Never heard that either :smile:
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by PanBiker » 13 Dec 2017, 00:03

Tripps wrote:
12 Dec 2017, 21:57
Just been on the phone to Uncle Jim who is from Preston - he used the phrase can't make moss nor sand on it" which I've never heard before, though the reference says it's common in the North of England.
Common usage in my family Tripps, previous generations all from Yorkshire.
Ian

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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 13 Dec 2017, 03:19

I never heard it until I came to Barlick but very common here Dave.
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by chinatyke » 13 Dec 2017, 04:54

Can't make hide nor hair of it.

Tripps: He also said that Jan Leeming was 'bowling at t'fence' in a TV programme yesterday - meaning she was on the lookout for a man.

:biggrin2: Love that one. Never heard it before.

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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 13 Dec 2017, 06:30

I've never heard it either but I like it!
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 14 Dec 2017, 05:04

I can't remember when I last heard anyone complain of having a Whitlow. (LINK) An alternative name for them is 'Felon' and that is also used for a general infection in cattle, often stemming from Mastitis which is given the same name. In advanced cases it can migrate to the joints of the legs.
Origin (OED)
Middle English: from Old French, literally ‘wicked, a wicked person’ (oblique case of fel ‘evil’), from medieval Latin fello, fellon-, of unknown origin. Compare with felon.
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Tizer » 15 Dec 2017, 09:36

In a novel last night I encountered a word new to me and had to look it up in the dictionary but couldn't find it anywhere - `inolination'. Here's what it turned out to be:
► Show Spoiler

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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 16 Dec 2017, 05:17

I love it! I wonder how many words have their origination in a simple transcription mistake like that.
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Tizer » 16 Dec 2017, 12:37

I'm now finding that book has many typos. It was first published in 1969 but this is a 2017 edition published by Harper Collins. I suspect they scanned the old book, did OCR on the scan then either didn't proofread the output or did it badly. The company is failing to show respect for the author and his family.

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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 17 Dec 2017, 03:28

I once bought a copy of an old engineering book published by a company who reckoned to specialise in 'rescuing' old classics. It was totally unreadable for the same reason. I gave it away after complaining, went out and found an old secondhand edition which proved to be cheaper!
Just been listening to Rabbi Shoshana Boyd Gelfand examining the prevalent feeling of not having enough. I was reminded that my daughter Susan has our version of a very ancient Jewish name.....
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Tizer » 17 Dec 2017, 09:41

I notice that a seller of geology books has: MANUAL OF THE MINERALOGY OF GREAT BRITAIN & IRELAND, original 1858 edition, by Gregg & Lettsom. An original edition of the classic work on British Mineralogy. He goes on to note: `Bookplate on inside cover showing that the first owner of this book was Theodore W. Rathbone of Allerton Priory, Liverpool (1798 - 1863), cotton broker and director of the London and Birmingham Railway.' You don't get that with facsimile editions. :smile:

An ancestor of my South African grandfather in the 1800s married a woman called Susanna. The South African lady who did some research for us over there said with that first name in SA she was probably of Dutch extraction. Which would mean I've got a bit of that in my genome as well as everything else!

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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Tripps » 17 Dec 2017, 18:21

Pedant's Corner - Just heard someone use the words 'least worst option', in connection with Brexit of course. I'd say there could only possibly be one 'worst' option. I'd get out more but it's very cold. . . . :smile:
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by plaques » 17 Dec 2017, 19:09

Perhaps 'worst' is like infinity. Some infinities are bigger than other infinities. Therefore you can have a ranges of 'worst' varying from 'not so bad to terrible'. Time for some tinsel under the cap.

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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Tripps » 17 Dec 2017, 21:14

Occam's razor - where there is a complex and a simple explanation for something - the simpler one is more likely to be true.

You will find more complex explanations by much cleverer people than me , but I've applied Occam's razor to them. :smile:
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 18 Dec 2017, 04:27

Tiz, the Rathbone family of Liverpool were big in cotton and are part of the history of the Gregs of Quarry Bank Mill at Wilmslow.... You might have Jewish ancestry as well....
Very high class posts! I remember that one of the advantages of being schooled by masters that had done classics was that I was taught the principle of Reductio ad Absurdem. Very handy in my working life.
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Stanley » 19 Dec 2017, 07:25

P mentioned Norman Davies educating us by using obscure words.... I came across another yesterday, also connected with the interpretation of genealogy.
'Tanistry' If you want to know what this is, have a look at THIS. Thanks Norman.......
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Re: DIALECT AND WORD MEANINGS

Post by Tripps » 19 Dec 2017, 10:47

I think I vaguely knew that. here's my evidence -

From the days when all greyhounds weren't black and white :smile: Tanist

and of course the Dublin 2 I/C The Tainiste
Born to be mild. . .

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