Marine Engineers

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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by chinatyke »

Stanley wrote: 14 Sep 2020, 03:16 You're right about the coverage of ships on the web Peter. I found no end of images of the Beltana from all those years ago and a diary of a bloke who did the trip to Europe on her which was the first clue I got that father had never been on her, his whole story of his WW1 experience was a legend! Fascinating discoveries and it made no difference to how I regard him. he did the best he could with the cards dealt to him. (Advert: See 'An Australian Life' on Lulu.com.)
An Aussie bending the truth romancing? Are you sure? :biggrin2: :extrawink:
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Stanley »

Oh yes China, no doubt about it.
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Tripps »

Re the cattle boat which capsized a couple of weeks ago. I bumped into an Australian news programme yesterday which said that the Japanese had called off the search for survivors. It surprised me that it had gone on for so long. There were two Australian vets on board, no bodies have been found, and there are still several lifeboats and dinghies not accounted for.

The commentator urged the Australian government to join in the search, and get the Japanese to resume it. He said that 30 days survival was quite possible in a lifeboat or dinghy.

He compared the poor Australian response with the immense multi million dollar effort put into the disappearance of the Malaysian aircraft a few years ago.
Born to be mild. . .
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Stanley »

That was one thing I admired about John Prescott. Even though he had done well in politics he never forgot his days at sea as a steward and fought for research and better searches into lost fishing boats and in particular the Derbyshire. (See this LINK)
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by plaques »

I'm not surprised they didn't find any survivors the waters round Japan are teeming with sharks. In the old days they used to follow the whaling ships round and anyone who fell in the water was a goner. There's still plenty of shark food thrown overboard from passing ships for it to make it worthwhile following behind for a good feed.
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Stanley »

Very true Ken. What a cheerful thought!
Mind you, there are plenty of metaphorical sharks about today, look at the Internet!
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Invernahaille »

Its Eighty years since A German U boat torpedoed and sank the Ellerman Lines City of Banares, carrying child evacuees from the UK to Canada and the USA.
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Stanley »

I think they told us about that at school, I have a vague memory of the name which is an unusual one.
(Hope Memorial School was CofE controlled and attached to St Martin's, Heaton Norris. We used to be lectured to be the vicar frequently and in those happy far off days the CofE was partial to a bit of propaganda!)
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Invernahaille »

Ellerman lines always named their ships after cities. Hence City Boats.
Benares is a city in India, known as the Holy city of the Ganges.
Sir John Reeves Ellerman, purchased George Smith and Co. City Line. Hence Ellerman City Line.
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Re: Marine Engineers

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1
Last edited by Invernahaille on 22 Sep 2020, 16:52, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Marine Engineers

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In the late sixties Ellerman invested heavily in container ships, in partnership with several partners, blue star etc. They built a total of six ships, Act 1-6.
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Stanley »

They were ahead of the curve Robert. Look at the size of them today!
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Invernahaille »

Stanley,
The realty was that the monopoly on shipping was coming to an end. Parts of the commonwealth, which were tied to agreements, where at the time expanding their merchant fleets. India was a classic example.
Containerisation, and the new markets made container ships highly profitable.
Three days turnaround, instead of several weeks in port discharging and loading cargo.
The officers and crew got an awful lot of sea-time in.
ACT (Associated Container Transport) Opened up the routes to the antipodes.
Manchester Liners had the Monopoly on Canada and the USA, they had been containerised for years before.
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Stanley »

:good:
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Re: Marine Engineers

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Thank goodness for containerisation and an end to the damage and pilferage at the docks, not to mention the whims of the unions. If ever a group of shirkers deserved their demise it was the dockers!
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Stanley »

You're right China in many ways but never forget what conditions and pay were like under the casual labour regime. They were forced to make a living wage anyway they could. That doesn't excuse the level of theft but it's worth bearing in mind.
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Re: Marine Engineers

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Succintly put Stanley.
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Stanley »

It was a brutal system and rife with corruption. If you hadn't bought the foreman stevedore a drink in the wet canteen you didn't get a ticket at the call out the following morning. But I'll agree about the system, all that time queuing on the Dock Road and then inside the dock.
Many a time they would walk out in the middle of a job, especially if the ship was behind schedule because then they could screw a better rate out of the agents. When they came back in it was usually because they had been offered a tonnage bonus. If that was the case they went down the queue pulling out the good loads. If you had 40 gallon drums you were sure of going to the head of the queue because all you had to do was kick them over and roll them. Plenty of weight in little time. Incidentally, the dockers would never get on the flat, the driver had to do all that work.
I shall have to stop, I could tell many stories about the dock work!
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Re: Marine Engineers

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Stanley wrote: 25 Sep 2020, 02:57 You're right China in many ways but never forget what conditions and pay were like under the casual labour regime. They were forced to make a living wage anyway they could. That doesn't excuse the level of theft but it's worth bearing in mind.
Nothing changes we still have zero hours contracts a contradiction in it's own right and should be outlawed. Wont save all the "unsecure" jobs due for a culling in the Chancellors latest economic propping package.

21st century and we are still forcing the unfortunate to be nothing more than surfs.
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Re: Marine Engineers

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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Stanley »

They're big engines aren't they Robert.
Ian, dead right, basically the same system. See THIS, we need a Ben Tillet!
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Invernahaille »

They need to be Stanley. They have to propel thousands of tons of ship and cargo. Once the ships go deep sea, the engine will not stop for weeks.
Except for any emergency maintenance.
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Stanley »

"Once the ships go deep sea, the engine will not stop for weeks."
And they love it don't they. I remember many years ago one of the oil companies did research on a small Petter petrol engine that worked on a poultry farm and ran 24X7 with a constant load. I forget now how long it ran before failing but it was staggering, far longer than anyone expected.
Another aspect of it is that all oil engines love working, they are at their best when under constant load.
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Invernahaille »

Stanley,
They do if they are well maintained.
When they get into port, thats when the work starts. Lube oil purifiers 6 inches thick in residue, same with the intake ports on the scavenges.
The fuel oil purifiers are cleaned every day.
The strangest thing is that you spend your life maintaining them. Yet when the ship comes to the end of its working life, and you take her for scrapping
Everything gets turned around, and you become a vandal, basically, blow the engine up.
Approaching the beaches, dead slow, you can hear the prop dig into the beach, then about half an hour later the engine gives up the ghost
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Re: Marine Engineers

Post by Stanley »

I agree Robert, ship-breaking is a dismal process. I remember once having to make a pickup at a small ship breaking yard at Briton Ferry where they did the job the old-fashioned way. I took a scavenge pump up to Newcastle on Tyne where it was to be re-used but most of the material went for re-melting.
Barlick has a connection with ship-breaking. When the old Majestic was being scrapped at the end of 19th century a man called Matt Hartley bought a lot of internal fittings and incorporated them in the new cinema he was building which he called 'The Majestic'. Some of the artefacts still survive in houses built by the family.

Image

This door panel in a bungalow on Greenberfield Lane is just one of them.
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