OneGuyFromBarlick

I'm not arguing against that. I think we are on a knife edge.
I listen to all the 'woke' comments about 'vaccine passports' and associated arguments about identity cards by the back door. I don't remember any problem during WW2 when, faced with clear and imminent threats, we had to reorganise the way we governed. We are in the same position now and personally I would like to see ID cards that included vaccination status. I don't see how the arguments against can have any validity because organisations like Amazon or the great social platforms already have more information about us than would ever be on an identity card. In addition our smart phones track us 24X7 if they are switched on.
I see the government seems committed to the vaccine passports, go the whole hog and have a proper identity card!

It isn't by accident that this lady is prominent in the media today. She was even on R 4 Womans Hour.

The lead scientist of the Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine programme has said giving people a third Covid jab is unnecessary in most cases because immunity from two doses is “lasting well”.
Professor Dame Sarah Gilbert said the “first dose has the most impact” for immunity, and advised that Britain should send more vaccines to countries where only small numbers of people have been vaccinated.
She told The Telegraph that current levels of vaccination in Britain are sufficient even against the more contagious Delta variant.
Dame Sarah said: “We will look at each situation; the immuno-compromised and elderly will receive boosters. But I don’t think we need to boost everybody. Immunity is lasting well in the majority of people.”

My personal experience says otherwise, and there have been previous contradictions in this matter between the Health Minister and others. Something's afoot.

I agree David, very fishy and I note that there was an immediate rebuttal by some dogsbody in government.

Couple of points for Tizer and Sue
Tizer- Are we sure that some of those reported as flu's were not coronaviruses of some sort, especially the one with some kind of extra symptoms.

Sue, if the main entry of virus to cell is using the spike protein, if it changes too much , it becomes ineffective, the main delta and similar changes have been an increase of entry efficiency, less attrition from environmental factors and some cloaking from the bodies natural immune system.

Coronaviruses have always been difficult to get an (affordable and effective) vaccine, and our present ones are rarely throwing up the same changes to the body that the virus does , which is concerning for those to whom this happens.

Looking at some studies there are (loosely) three kinds of immune response - a quick and dirty attack mainly by cells in the blood stream, a more detailed attack as the actual invader is recognised leading to T cell and similar specific items in quantiy from their areas of production (and its this response the vaccines are good at training up in the body ), so indeed anti-bodies do fall out of circulation, but the memory effect in an efficient immune system does appear to be primed better by a vacine, and the effect does not seem to be wearing off with time , but this is a delay response, hence a programme for 'vulunerable' - which may include elderly may have some benefit, that it not needed for a widespread booster vaccination as such. There is a 4th line of body defence which is the self destruction of cells infected and those nearby - its this that appears to me to cause the cough occurring particulary.

As to masks, in hospital yesterday there are still administrators walking around wearing them not covering nose (virus breeds in the narrow passageways at back of nose), or taking them off to talk to other people. There are full face clear masks avalible with a filtration system, I presume they cost about £90 a go, Adverts on youtube promote them to me.

Whyperion wrote: ↑11 Sep 2021, 21:27 Tizer- Are we sure that some of those reported as flu's were not coronaviruses of some sort, especially the one with some kind of extra symptoms.

Laboratory testing for viruses by the PCR method is very specific and wouldn't confuse covid with influenza.

Susan and I met a medical man at Bancroft yesterday and we had an interesting conversation that included Covid. I mentioned my BCG immunotherapy any value against Covid and he said that he had wondered the same thing and also wondered if the fact that the older generation had been immunised with BCG for TB meant that this explained the relative vulnerability of immigrants from countries where this was not routine. (He let slip he was 'on the medical staff' at Stafford hospital and I pressed him. He was senior ENT Registrar for many years up to retirement! He was a nice man and Susan and I pulled his leg.)

Javid has hit the corvid passports for mass assemblies on the head. We don't want any more restrictions. This raises two major points. Is it to breath some life or death depending on your view into the hospitality / entertainment industry. or is it to get this third wave out of the way during the summer before the Influenza season starts collapsing the NHS completely? Since people appear happy to accept the current 150 deaths a day the government may be thinking that they can get away with 400 a day and not affect there poll rating too much. Watch this space but put your tin hat on first.

Johnson has promised that there will be no lock down at Christmas. I cannot think of anything more irresponsible to say at this moment in time. As you say 150 deaths a day and climbing along with all the other trends. Christmas is 3 months away and we haven't even started the flu season yet. The man is a complete idiot and should be held to account for his ineptitude.

It's no wonder we've had so much trouble with infections...
`Covid: More than 300,000 suspected of breaking quarantine rules' LINK
`Nearly a third of people arriving in England and Northern Ireland as the coronavirus Delta variant took off may have broken quarantine rules. More than 300,000 cases were passed to investigators between March and May, according to figures seen by the BBC. The government was not able to say how many of these were found to have broken the rules or could not be traced. The Home Office has said it aims to pay home visits to all travellers suspected of not following the rules. But Labour's shadow home secretary Nick Thomas-Symonds said the figures obtained by the BBC "confirm our worst fears" about the government's "lax border policy". And he accused the Home Office of "gross negligence"...'.

We seem to have reached a stage where many people are behaving as if the pandemic is over and done with, and are living as they did before it all started, whilst many still isolate and take full precautions. There seem to be no restrictions on attendance at sporting events at all, and a Cabinet Minister thinks it's OK to go clubbing.

Last year when this thing was at its height - no one I knew had it, or knew anyone who had it. This year after 80% have had two 'vaccine' injections, I know of of many who have succumbed - several after two (alleged 'vaccine' ) injections. I appreciate the fact that deaths and hospitalisations are reduced, but they are not eliminated, and being in the highest risk age group. . . . .

How will the flu jabs be managed this year? What will go into them? There was no flu in Australia this year which is usually the template for our winter vaccine. Will it be of any value?

Show me as puzzled.

PS The email I recveived last night and which triggered this post said -

"Unfortunately the virus is still there. Over the past few weeks my brother and his partner have both had Covid and had been fully vaccinated. One of my nieces and her 3 children all had it and the youngest is 11. Last week my other niece and her children aged 13 and 9 also succumbed. "

It doesn't help when Bozo Johnson announces now that he guarantees there will be no lock down at Christmas. What kind of message does that send to the gullible? I noticed on my last visit to Aldi that apart from the staff there were only about 5 people including myself who were wearing a mask, back to late evening shopping I reckon. No vaccine passports, then they were the best thing since sliced bread and would be implemented, 3 days later, no vaccine passports! Organisation of a piss up in a brewery comes to mind, unfortunately more folk will die due to the sheer incompetency of this government.

Good posts and I agree with all of you. David puts it in a nutshell... "We seem to have reached a stage where many people are behaving as if the pandemic is over and done with, and are living as they did before it all started, whilst many still isolate and take full precautions." Mark my card as one of the latter. Apart from my immediate bubble I am still shielding and will continue to do so.

Tizer wrote: ↑12 Sep 2021, 09:29

Whyperion wrote: ↑11 Sep 2021, 21:27 Tizer- Are we sure that some of those reported as flu's were not coronaviruses of some sort, especially the one with some kind of extra symptoms.

Laboratory testing for viruses by the PCR method is very specific and wouldn't confuse covid with influenza.

In 1688 ?

Stanley wrote: ↑13 Sep 2021, 03:46 Susan and I met a medical man at Bancroft yesterday and we had an interesting conversation that included Covid. I mentioned my BCG immunotherapy any value against Covid ..

I cannot see how a vaccination against a Bacterium can have significant impact against a Virus, assuming the bacterium does not exploit similar protein binding / breaking cellular methodologies and have similar proteins on or within itself that the vaccine would recognise.
I would contend that Indian cases are mainly from older ones having some greater weight issues, and the living in close family groups and working in generally occupations that were in proximity and poor ventilation. For African heritage again for some weight was an issue, younger persons tending to group together and living in the more densly populated parts of UK and their towns and finally having quite a few family members working in the heath care sector placing them in vulnerability.

See THIS BBC report on attitudes expressed by the doctors.... Listening to them, and I think they must be respected as good opinions, it looks as though the government is taking a big gamble and speaking for myself, if I was a betting man, my money would be on the doctors.
I've said it before, I get the feeling we might be in for a rough winter!

Set up the NHS app so I now have access to my Covid Passport. There are two versions, domestic or foreign travel. I probably won't need it until February when I'll use the 'download PDF' option. After reading Sue's positive experience with a paper copy it makes sense.
The newly installed NHS app prompted for connection to my GP surgery data used by the Patient Access app, it looks as though I may be able to use just the NHS app

Do I need it to go to Colne on Friday?

Stanley wrote: ↑16 Sep 2021, 02:49 Do I need it to go to Colne on Friday?

I have no idea, I need it to board a cruise ship...

I'll not go via canal then.....

I'm not sure as to whether I will get a booster job with my flue jab on October 7th at the Well pharmacy.
Shock horror!! See THIS report about professional dances refusing Covid jabs and causing competitors to refuse to dance with them.

I know we've all commented on it but the majority of people have ditched PPE, as thogh the pandemic is over. I feel like shouting at them but it would do no good. When I did my shopping on Friday I had my mask on and vinyl gloves as usual. I noticed some maskless people looking at me as the shop got busy. I wonder who's out of step with reality?

I heard reports of MPs saying that masks are useless. They are wrong, masks may not be the perfect answer to stopping transmission of infection but the using of them is a signal that the wearer is aware of transmission and is going to operate a 2 metre distance and try not to be a danger to others.

nanobody treatment for marking Covid-19 viruses to help the body kill them.
BBC "Covid: Immune therapy from llamas shows promise"
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-58628689

I suppose OK until/If the virus mutates enough to throw off the nanoparticle ( physically or metaphorically)

The latest Covid figures suggest that secondary school children make up the biggest cohort of infection. This could be due to more testing of school children but also this could indicate a coming rise in the number of 18 to 30s getting infected as universities go back.
Whatever the truth, the bottom line is that Covid is still out there roaming the land. Don't forget this and keep taking precautions.