POLITICS CORNER

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tripps » 10 Jun 2018, 09:51

President Trump has left the summit early, and gone to Singapore to meet Kim Jong Un. They will meet on the resort island of Sentosa to the South of the island.

I know Sentosa better as Blakang Mati The name in Malay means 'death behind', which is quite prophetic, given the fate of the island during WW2.
Born to be mild. . .

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 10 Jun 2018, 10:23

After leaving the G7 Trump has thrown a tantrum over something that Trudeau said. Yesterday I saw a photo of Trump and Trudeau side by side at G7 and I said to her that Trump wouldn't like Trudeau because the Canadian is obviously a lot taller than he is. I like the BBC correspondent's description of Trump acting like a truculent teenager - that's just what he is, a truculent spoilt teenager who throws tantrums whenever things don't go his way. And now he's the `leader of the free world'. You couldn't make it up! The world is turning into some kind of daft reality show.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 11 Jun 2018, 03:55

"The world is turning into some kind of daft reality show." The only modification I would make to that Tiz is that I think it's already happened.
Trump is repeating the mistakes of the inter war years and then they were a major factor in triggering world wide depression. It would appear that the 'G6' Have remembered some of the lessons from that!
As for the meeting with Kim Jong Un, why does it remind me of Nixon's 'rapprochement' with China?
May being sidelined at the G6.5...... get used to it, this is the natural consequence of political and diplomatic incompetence. In her own way she is on the same isolationism track as Trump.
I see no reasons for being cheerful.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 11 Jun 2018, 09:29

It's time the US law men stepped up their investigation of Trump's links to Russia. He seems to be doing all he can to help them and to hinder the West. He's bringing about the downfall of the Western World as we know it.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 12 Jun 2018, 03:01

The growing use of the tactic of being disruptive ignores all the lessons of history about its use in the past.
There is much coverage this morning of the Parliamentary hazards facing T May this week but to my mind the far mare dangerous sign is THIS BBC report on the dire economic figures released yesterday. "The Office for National Statistics' official figures put growth at 0.1% for the first three months of the year."..... This is within the range of calculating error and in fact could be a sign of recession. Almost certainly so since most leading economists say that 3% growth is needed to maintain a healthy economy. Could it be that the increasing use of credit by domestic consumers simply to keep their heads above water is drying up? "Events Dear Boy".
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 13 Jun 2018, 05:12

Disruptive political and diplomatic behaviour. The events in Singapore suggest that there is a place for what Teddy Roosevelt called 'speaking softly but carrying a big stick'. I am no fan of President Trump but am forced to admit that on the face of it he has achieved something that has eluded everyone for years, he has persuaded Kim Jong Un to talk. It remains to be seen how much substance there is in this achievement and I suspect that 'speaking softly' and old fashioned diplomacy should be the way forward from here on but on the face of it we are in a better place.
T May scrambled her way through the crucial commons vote yesterday but only at the cost of using every political trick in the book. Now we shall see what effect she can produce on Brussels. I suspect political tricks will not work with the EU. Mind you it isn't all over in the commons, the Brexiteers see yesterday as a concession by May to the Remainers. They will be keeping their powder dry for later when we get to the trade talks......
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 14 Jun 2018, 03:36

From the looks of it, the political tricks didn't work in the House either. Brexit is working up to a boil and it's useless to try to predict anything. This is where Tory policies have led us and we allowed it to happen. Start digging a hole to shelter in......
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 14 Jun 2018, 07:01

The Brexiteers have this cunning plan, just bumble along not making any progress and blaming it all on the EU. In one years time it will be too late to do anything. The good people will have got everything they have voted for. Closed borders, UK based laws. Trade with the rest of the World, £350M per week to the NHS, everything except more money in their pockets. El Derado here we come.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 14 Jun 2018, 22:55

Sack the lot of them and get the Chinese to run the country!

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 15 Jun 2018, 02:36

They already are.......
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 15 Jun 2018, 09:49

What a strange world we live in. On 22 June 2016, of those MPs who had declared their position on the EU Referendum, 75% supported Remain; in the case of Labour MPs it was even higher with 96% supporting Remain (compared with 57% for Conservatives). In other words, most MPs judged that remaining in the EU would be better for their constituents than leaving. (Data here: LINK) And yet here we are, with those MPs allowing the UK to break from the EU when they know that it will be bad for their constituents. Surely this is shirking their responsibility as the constituents' representatives? If I appointed a lawyer to represent me in court I wouldn't expect him to do something against my interests. It feels like we've lost touch with reality and the MPs have abandoned us.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tripps » 15 Jun 2018, 10:17

chinatyke wrote:
14 Jun 2018, 22:55
Sack the lot of them and get the Chinese to run the country!
Stanley wrote:
15 Jun 2018, 02:36
They already are.....
What could possibly go wrong?

Chinese ambition
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 15 Jun 2018, 12:12

Did Mrs May's 'Get of Gaol' card on the EU Withdrawal Bill only work because she told a few porkies? The Remainers who thought they were going to get a say in formulating some exit strategy should the Government end up with a No Deal has now been turned on its head. By adding some weasel words to what was thought to be an agreed amendment she has shown her true colours. The Tories have suddenly found out something that Joe public has known for ages. What politicians appear to say and what they do are two entirely different things. Welcome to the real world. Of course if Corbyn would play the game they could create an enemy which would take our minds of their own cock up. There you have it 'its Corbyn's fault!

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 15 Jun 2018, 15:56

Jeremy's busy having a bit of trouble keeping his troops in order. He told them to abstain from the vote but a significant number ignored him and voted, some for and some against. And some resigned because they didn't like being told what to do. It's probably like running the local allotments society! :smile:

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 15 Jun 2018, 17:31

Tripps wrote:
15 Jun 2018, 10:17
chinatyke wrote:
14 Jun 2018, 22:55
Sack the lot of them and get the Chinese to run the country!
Stanley wrote:
15 Jun 2018, 02:36
They already are.....
What could possibly go wrong?

Chinese ambition
:good:
I like how the Yanks say China has stolen secrets from them, they should keep them more secure! Don't the Yanks engage in espionage? You don't need to answer that, my brother in law was a communications expert and sniper in the US marines and human rights issues were the last thing to be respected.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 16 Jun 2018, 02:59

Quite right Tiz. I believe that the reason for the mismatch is that most MPs spend more time thinking about the consequences for themselves and their grasp of the levers of power than the interests of their constituents. We saw the same thing in the Blairite MPs opposition to Corbyn. I am convinced that what was actually going on was the fact that they hated the power to elect a leader being in the hands of the members, they think it should be their prerogative to decide. In other words self interest rules OK? Bugger democracy!
May had to resort to guile and trickery to escape defeat in the Commons and so of course she lied, or rather was economical with the truth and got the lawyers to work out some cunning language in the small print. She won't get away with it, the Brexiteers are gradually working her into a corner and they know it, that's why they are keeping stum. They know that by the time she hits the buffers in Brussels in October it will be too late to retrieve the mistakes that have been made and hard Brexit, which is what they are after, will be the only course open to us.
See THIS and ask yourself the question; "Do Tory Dinosaurs actually exist"? What on earth is he thinking about? No, cancel that, is he thinking at all? What a wonderful institution Parliament is.....
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 16 Jun 2018, 08:27

First Trump's lack of judgement resulted in Manafort being made his campaign manager. Now it looks like Trump will help him avoid punishment for his midemeanours...

`Paul Manafort jailed by judge for alleged witness tampering' LINK
Donald Trump's former campaign manager Paul Manafort has had his bail revoked by a Washington DC judge and has been ordered to jail pending trial'
`On Friday morning, Mr Trump distanced himself from his former campaign aide. By the afternoon, however, he appeared to offer a lifeline, noting that his prosecution was "very unfair". That's the same kind of language the president has used in justifying pardons for former Arizona sheriff Joe Arpaio, Bush administration official Scooter Libby and conservative commentator Dinesh D'Souza. Mr Trump's personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, was even more direct, telling a New York newspaper that the Manafort situation could eventually get "cleaned up" by presidential pardons. That may be exactly what Mr Manafort is counting on.'

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 17 Jun 2018, 03:56

He thinks that as President he has complete freedom as owner of the US.
Brexit..... Have a look and listen of THIS then retire to a corner and weep.... Talk about fiddling while Rome burns......
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 17 Jun 2018, 09:04

Ah, but TMay has pulled a rabbit out of the hat...and it's a magic rabbit too! She's promising that the NHS will get Bozo's magic £350 million a week from our Brexit departure. Not only that, she's throwing in lots more cash just to make sure the Brexiteers are satisfied (but money will magically disappear from workers' pockets at the same moment). Is she taking advice from The Donald?

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 17 Jun 2018, 12:08

Promises, promises, Mrs May is now making promises about funding in 2023. The first hurdle is that she has to still be Prime Minister when they are supposed to take affect. Any new government or even new Prime Minister will be quite in order to say "nothing to do with me". Then she has just muckied her ticket by going back on her promises about the Reform Bill and that was to her own backbencher MP's. Even the governments studies on the financial outcomes of the Brexit show each outcome to be detrimental to the economy. Ie: less tax revenue. The already 'firm commitments' to maintain funding on this, that, and the other, means there is no Brexit dividend left to hand out to the NHS. In normal circumstances these promises would have been followed by screams of "black holes" or has everyone just shrugged their shoulders and say " there goes another flying pig?

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 17 Jun 2018, 15:51

Stanley wrote:
16 Jun 2018, 02:59
See THIS and ask yourself the question; "Do Tory Dinosaurs actually exist"? What on earth is he thinking about? No, cancel that, is he thinking at all? What a wonderful institution Parliament is.....
That's the link to Tory MP Christopher Chope blocking progress of the `upskirting bill '. I read that a comedian has suggested that we should replace the word `upskirting' with `choping'. :smile:

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 18 Jun 2018, 03:16

The promise to pay more than the £350million per week into the NHS at an unspecified date might be a Cunning Wheeze too far. What she has done in effect is to make the Remainers into bad guys if they vote against hard Brexit. I suspect the genesis for this idea was the Gang of 60 and perhaps that's why Hammond fought it tooth and nail.
Parliament is no longer the king post of democracy, they have turned it into a cock fighting pit and whoever screams the loudest will win. The non-coordinated Opposition Parties are letting us down badly.
Guess who the losers will be.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 18 Jun 2018, 05:47

Later..... Chuck THIS BBC account of the report issued by the British Chambers of Commerce forecasting worse growth figures for this year and next than at any time since 2009. The 'Miracle Economy' is nowhere near as healthy as the government suggest yet it hasn't stopped them shaking the 'Money Tree'. (Forest?) Last time this happened it was described as a recession.....
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 19 Jun 2018, 02:56

I had to switch programmes when I was treated to T May doing the hospital rounds telling everyone how she was saving the NHS. The bald fact is that if they actually deliver the 3.4% it isn't enough to make up for what the NHS has lost in reductions and inflation since 2010 and the start of austerity. A cunning wheeze, take half the funding away to squeeze more work out of the staff and then when breaking point is reached give back part of what you took away and cast yourself in the role of the Second Coming. You get good publicity and save money. In political terms this is a good deal!
I noticed how bad her posture was and that she is not walking easily......
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 19 Jun 2018, 07:52

I don't normally give much store to polls that supposedly reflect peoples opinions but when experts start to doubt the financial logic its not surprising that ordinary people who have been following the latest political shenanigans will reach the same conclusion. Poll.. Normally people are prepared to give the benefit of doubt about what is going on but Mrs May appears to have lost the popular support and once this happens its a very difficult if not impossible position to recover from. The background to all this is the abysmal performance of the EU negotiations. The current approach of being prepared to commit financial suicide rather than negotiate some compromise is behind the resistance to give MP's a last say on the EU Reform Bill. Finally, just when the House of Lords, an institute that I agree needs reforming, starts to do exactly what its there for, there's a big push to blame them for all the Brexit troubles. Look out Mrs May the sharks are circling.

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