POLITICS CORNER

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 09 Jul 2018, 05:35

Later..... the resignation came too late for the hard copy papers but online there is a lot of reporting. The consensus is that this problem is going to get worse. A key factor is how Boris reacts. Despite the fact that he is a buffoon what he does is important because he is at heart a coward, he's proved that already, dodging serious meetings and not opposing at Chequers. If he decides to jump ship this means that the overall political equation is favouring a full blown revolt and a leadership challenge. T May is going to be in for an interesting week! I said a long time ago that the leadership was a poisoned chalice and I think Mrs May would agree this morning......
What interests me is how hard the opposing parties go after the Tories now. They have an open goal and a 'U' Turn isn't out of the question. There could be a vote in Parliament and the prospect of a second referendum or declaring the Exit Referendum as advisory only. I think the latter is more likely.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 09 Jul 2018, 09:06

I've just heard yet another Tory talking about the resignation. Jeremy Hunt giving his views and saying that Mrs May must be supported.
It struck me that what we are looking at here with these people is less to do with proper management of Brexit than about the survival of the government and its Leader. Perhaps even of the Tory Party itself.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 09 Jul 2018, 11:51

From my previous post :- The outgoing message is likely to be ' fight to the last bullet but one'. D Davis hasn't used the bullet for the intended purpose. It looks like he has popped it in his pocket to be used later. I wonder when the 'shoot out' will be?

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 09 Jul 2018, 15:04

Boris has resigned as UK Foreign Secretary.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 09 Jul 2018, 15:10

Don't know whether I should be happy to see the buffoon go or outraged at his lack of loyalty to his leader.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by PanBiker » 09 Jul 2018, 15:25

by PanBiker » Tue Jul 12, 2016 9:19 am
Both, she's there with no mandate and she's a Tory so her policies are not mine. Best woman for the job though, it's a poison chalice.

Here's my post from the Voting Systems thread just short of two years ago, first time I coined poison chalice on the site for TM's predicament.

Looks like a meltdown in her cabinet and does not bode well for her meeting with her backbenchers, you can just hear the knives being sharpened. Nice when one of your predictions come good. :extrawink:
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 10 Jul 2018, 02:13

None of what is going on now after Boris goes is anything to do with Brexit or what is good for the UK. It's all about steadying the ship and keeping the government afloat! Too many careers at stake.
We live in interesting times. See THIS for the latest assessment.....
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 11 Jul 2018, 05:25

It becomes clear that whilst there is no appetite for a leadership challenge in the Tory Party there is a growing guerilla war building up led by the Brexiteers who are determined to scrap the Chequers Plan. This has been noted in Brussels.... I'm listening to a French politician talking about the prospects for trade. He says quite clearly that there is certain to be more friction in trade and tariffs. In addition he doesn't see how the UK can avoid staying in the Single Market to avoid suicide and this means that prospects for free trade deals with other countries are going to be 'severely limited'. Asked about Boris Johnson he laughed. "Formidable talent but still a kid". He has known Boris and his parents well for many years.
I was thinking this morning as I had my walk..... Cameron was forced into a Referendum by the disunity in the Tory Party. Nothing has changed. This whole Brexit affair is a symptom of a divided Tory Party and this becomes more and more clear. When will the country waken up to this?
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 11 Jul 2018, 12:37

Stanley wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 05:25
Cameron was forced into a Referendum by the disunity in the Tory Party. Nothing has changed. This whole Brexit affair is a symptom of a divided Tory Party and this becomes more and more clear. When will the country waken up to this?
And adopt communism, Comrade? You could do worse!

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 12 Jul 2018, 03:16

That would be a bit too far China even for me but I wouldn't object to a properly run Demand Economy scenario....
T May had a set back yesterday, one of her defence mechanisms collapsed when Ingerland lost to the Croats...... Now she'll have to talk about what matters. I wouldn't be in her shoes for all the tea in China!
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tripps » 12 Jul 2018, 18:12

chinatyke wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 12:37
And adopt communism, Comrade? You could do worse!
If you think Communism is so good why not go and live somewhere under Communist rule?


Oh - wait a minute. . . . :laugh5:
Born to be mild. . .

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 13 Jul 2018, 03:50

No point in trying to analyse the madhouse that is current politics. Like everyone else I suspect I am thoroughly confused and this in itself is an indication of just how bad (and even surreal!) things are.
Then we have Trump giving his opinions.....
See THIS for a BBC report on remarks made by Trump last night. Disruptive behaviour at it's finest! He's lobbed a grenade into Downing Street..... With friends like this who needs enemies!
Later reports suggest that his intervention is having an effect. T May is going to have an interesting press conference.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by PanBiker » 13 Jul 2018, 08:43

Trump has had a go at Sadiq Khan as well tweeting that he supports terrorism! It's all about the crowd funded inflatable baby. He's given as good as he got and has said that it is not his job so censure freedom of speech in a democracy. Baby Trump will fly today. :biggrin2:
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 13 Jul 2018, 08:58

Tripps wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 18:12
chinatyke wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 12:37
And adopt communism, Comrade? You could do worse!
If you think Communism is so good why not go and live somewhere under Communist rule?


Oh - wait a minute. . . . :laugh5:
I was brought up believing all the propaganda that said communism was evil but surprisingly I love it: peace, law and order, and very relaxed if you follow the rules. I went to the police station in Nanning on Wednesday because all foreigners must register where they are living if not staying in a registered hotel, and I was in and out in under 5 minutes. I've never been challenged or asked for my passport by the police in 14 years here. Wonderful system!

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 13 Jul 2018, 09:03

PanBiker wrote:
13 Jul 2018, 08:43
Trump has had a go at Sadiq Khan as well tweeting that he supports terrorism! It's all about the crowd funded inflatable baby. He's given as good as he got and has said that it is not his job so censure freedom of speech in a democracy. Baby Trump will fly today. :biggrin2:
I don't agree with flying the Trump blimp, it's insulting and unnecessary and just not cricket.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 13 Jul 2018, 09:36

All these meetings with Trump seem completely pointless - we can't believe a word he says so it's a waste of time. If that's not enough we hear this morning that he and White House Chief of Staff John Kelly are shouting at each other all the time. With a bit of luck the Queen will treat Trump like a spoilt child!

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by PanBiker » 13 Jul 2018, 11:15

chinatyke wrote:
13 Jul 2018, 09:03
I don't agree with flying the Trump blimp, it's insulting and unnecessary and just not cricket.
But it's perfectly OK for him to insult via tweets everyone and everything that is not in line with his fantasy world.

Flying the blimp may not be "cricket" as you say but thankfully peaceful protest is still alive and well in our democracy.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 13 Jul 2018, 11:34

PanBiker wrote:
13 Jul 2018, 11:15
chinatyke wrote:
13 Jul 2018, 09:03
I don't agree with flying the Trump blimp, it's insulting and unnecessary and just not cricket.
But it's perfectly OK for him to insult via tweets everyone and everything that is not in line with his fantasy world.

Flying the blimp may not be "cricket" as you say but thankfully peaceful protest is still alive and well in our democracy.
I'm not a fan of Trump and don't agree with his insults and way of doing things. Enjoy your democracy, personally I think it's a shamble.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by PanBiker » 13 Jul 2018, 12:46

Well, as a citizen in our shamble of a democracy I know I am better off.

Try standing on a soapbox and shouting at your chosen countries Party Leader in your "Wonderful System. That's been tried before and it didn't end very well.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 13 Jul 2018, 14:42

PanBiker wrote:
13 Jul 2018, 12:46
Well, as a citizen in our shamble of a democracy I know I am better off.

Try standing on a soapbox and shouting at your chosen countries Party Leader in your "Wonderful System. That's been tried before and it didn't end very well.
:biggrin2: :good:
We don't have anything to grumble about! Besides, I'm a foreigner and dare not do anything that would lead to my return to the UK. Controlled? Who? Me? :laugh5:

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 14 Jul 2018, 02:44

I think you two may be falling for the con trick. You are being diverted from the realities. Trump is a racist misogynistic bully who is a danger to both China and the UK, May is fawning on anyone who bolsters her position. Meanwhile the clock ticks and we slide down the slope to the reality of the EU verdict on the proposals.....
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 14 Jul 2018, 08:44

I hope you all heard about Trump claiming he correctly predicted the outcome of the Brexit referendum to reporters when he was here visiting his golf course? The BBC man disputed it, saying it was fake news. Trump then accused the BBC man of fake news. The BBC man has dug out the recorded interview and shown that Trump made the claim the day after the Referendum; he hadn't even arrived in the UK at the time. Other reporters have backed up the BBC man. Trump's press lady (Sanders?) has said Trump is telling the truth and the reporters are all wrong!

I think that world leaders should get together and agree to ignore Trump because they can't trust anything he says.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by PanBiker » 14 Jul 2018, 09:52

Stanley wrote:
14 Jul 2018, 02:44
I think you two may be falling for the con trick. You are being diverted from the realities. Trump is a racist misogynistic bully who is a danger to both China and the UK, May is fawning on anyone who bolsters her position. Meanwhile the clock ticks and we slide down the slope to the reality of the EU verdict on the proposals.....
And what do you suggest we do about it?

I for one am active in opposition politics at branch and constituency level and well aware of the issues and the reality.

Cant speak for China of course in his wonderful one party state system.
Ian

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 14 Jul 2018, 10:15

Unfortunately I don't think there is anything we can do about the present situation, Ian, at least not while our leaders seem hell bent on handing over the UK to populists. I suppose at least you have your hopes in Labour getting in but I don't even have that. It's not that I think they can't get in but that if they did J. Corbyn would continue with Brexit and we'd still jump off the cliff. I see a parallel between here and the US. When Trump's supporters find out either (a) they've been well and truly conned or (b) they're forced by traumatic events to accept a change from Trump, there will be `big, big trouble, very bigly, and that's not fake news'. When the Leavers in the UK face the same, knowing they've been conned or forced by events to quit the Brexit plan, then there'll be serious trouble here too. Like Bruff once said, the best we can do is to sit back and watch the exciting events! :smile:

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 14 Jul 2018, 12:06

Trump is only the figurehead of an extreme right wing Republican Party. All prevailing logic and word meanings get turned on their heads. This group represents the fraction of the 1% of the big wealth and capital owners in the World. All existing agreement and trade deals can be cancelled at a moments notice on 'security' grounds. Security in this sense means the loss of profit to this minority group. Anything that will improve profit margins even to the extent of lower standards of living to ordinary Americans is acceptable to their goal of ultimate World power. Sadly, the UK and EU should now be keeping any of the American proposals at arms length. This includes of offers of trade, IMF and World Bank assistance and even NATO which now appears to be moving in a direction of protecting American trade and infrastructure rather than military defense against third party invasion. Trump's cosying up to Putin's Russia could be more to do with the control of oil and gas in Europe than coming to terms with the difference in politics. If the EU turned their backs on America I cannot see any down side to remaining in the EU.

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